Mennonite Measles in Texas

[Ken]

Add to the poor state of science education in conservative Mennonite communities, and you have the perfect storm.

Perfect storm of what?

Perfect storm of the biggest measles outbreak in years. Which would have been trivially easy to prevent.

[JohnH]

Add to the poor state of science education in conservative Mennonite communities, and you have the perfect storm.

Perfect storm of what?

Perfect storm of the biggest measles outbreak in years.

... because of the state of science education of 0.1% of the population, which is incidentally better than state of education of the rest of the population (when measured with things like basic literacy, basic math, and so on)?

[Ken]

Perfect storm of what?

Perfect storm of the biggest measles outbreak in years.

... because of the state of science education of 0.1% of the population, which is incidentally better than state of education of the rest of the population (when measured with things like basic literacy, basic math, and so on)?

I don't know what the state of science education is at conservative Mennonite high schools in west Texas. Perhaps you could share what biology, chemistry, and physics textbooks they use and we can take a look? Or at least share how much science training their teachers have?

[JohnH]

I don't know what the state of science education is at conservative Mennonite high schools in west Texas. Perhaps you could share what biology, chemistry, and physics textbooks they use and we can take a look? Or at least share how much science training their teachers have?

... none of which is an assessment of the actual state of science literacy of a population of people. It does however, belie a mindset of credentialism.

Overall, plain people are better educated than the general public when using rather basic measures like literacy.

[Ken]

I don't know what the state of science education is at conservative Mennonite high schools in west Texas. Perhaps you could share what biology, chemistry, and physics textbooks they use and we can take a look? Or at least share how much science training their teachers have?

... none of which is an assessment of the actual state of science literacy of a population of people. It does however, belie a mindset of credentialism.

Overall, plain people are better educated than the general public when using rather basic measures like literacy.

Reading and science are different subjects. And I didn't ask about credentials. I asked about science training. Which we could be formal or informal. How much science background or experience of any kind do the teachers in west Texas Mennonite schools have? Any at all? Do they even teach science?

And, in any event, we didn't see a measles outbreak in the population as a whole. We saw a measles outbreak in a small isolated Mennonite community in West Texas.

[JohnH]

And I didn't ask about credentials. I asked about science training.

... in other words, a credential.

[quote[Which we could be formal or informal. How much science background or experience of any kind do the teachers in west Texas Mennonite schools have? Any at all? Do they even teach science?[/quote]

What kind of inane question is that?

And, in any event, we didn't see a measles outbreak in the population as a whole. We saw a measles outbreak in a small isolated Mennonite community in West Texas.

Incorrect. You should go read up on the myriad of news reporting on the issue.

[Judas Maccabeus]

I have yet to hear a reasoned religious or theological objection, the whole "cell line" reasoning is conspicuous in its absence. Mostly I have heard something like "I've done my own research." Some don't seem to understand that anyone can post anything on the internet.

I am assuming you are referring to the broader population and not my religious cell line argument?

Yes, your line of argumentation is fairly atypical. The only one I have heard that from in the past was an SSPX catholic.

[Judas Maccabeus]

Perfect storm of what?

Perfect storm of the biggest measles outbreak in years.

... because of the state of science education of 0.1% of the population, which is incidentally better than state of education of the rest of the population (when measured with things like basic literacy, basic math, and so on)?

Yes, but the state of science education in our communities is poor to nonexistent in many cases. Only the really large schools do a good job. (Shout out to Josh G. here) I am a science teacher in a conservative Mennonite school, for the last five years. I go to conferences whenever I can. I have taught "breakouts" at a few of these. We need to face the fact that we cannot teach science simply by having a teacher, recite a textbook. In conservative, Mennonite schools lab facilities ranged from fairly good in many, really large high schools, to completely non-existent, with a homeroom teacher attempting to teach science. While they make a valiant effort, seldom ever is the job particularly good..

I have been a houseguest in a number of Mennonite homes, and typically when they find out I'm a teacher I wind up getting shown various problems that they are having difficulty understanding. I have seen at least two cases where teachers in conservative Mennonite schools were unable to teach their 10th graders how to do the falling bodies, acceleration problem correctly. Now this may not seem like much, but it's likely indicative of the rest of the curriculum they are getting. My answer this is we really need to up our game, I would start sending some of our teachers over the summer to get further education, a local community college is programs in general biology, general physics, and perhaps a little bit of chemistry would go a long way.

At the middle and high school level, a teacher with at least a fair when do you want to eat your thing?, post high school background, would go a long way towards getting us up to a level where we're really teaching science. The lack of understanding of how science works, along with an over-reliance on the Internet, likely is the cause of many of these problems. I do not permit my students to do papers or assignments relying solely on online sources. My opening tirade when school begins is one on the unreliability of online sources, many do not appreciate the fact that anyone can put anything on the Internet, true or not. While we do an excellent job with basic reading skills, basic math, skills, and many of our students write quite well, science education is where we really do not do a very good job in general.

[Ken]

Perfect storm of the biggest measles outbreak in years.

... because of the state of science education of 0.1% of the population, which is incidentally better than state of education of the rest of the population (when measured with things like basic literacy, basic math, and so on)?

Yes, but the state of science education in our communities is poor to nonexistent in many cases. Only the really large schools do a good job. (Shout out to Josh G. here) I am a science teacher in a conservative Mennonite school, for the last five years. I go to conferences whenever I can. I have taught "breakouts" at a few of these. We need to face the fact that we cannot teach science simply by having a teacher, recite a textbook. In conservative, Mennonite schools lab facilities ranged from fairly good in many, really large high schools, to completely non-existent, with a homeroom teacher attempting to teach science. While they make a valiant effort, seldom ever is the job particularly good..

I have been a houseguest in a number of Mennonite homes, and typically when they find out I'm a teacher I wind up getting shown various problems that they are having difficulty understanding. I have seen at least two cases where teachers in conservative Mennonite schools were unable to teach their 10th graders how to do the falling bodies, acceleration problem correctly. Now this may not seem like much, but it's likely indicative of the rest of the curriculum they are getting. My answer this is we really need to up our game, I would start sending some of our teachers over the summer to get further education, a local community college is programs in general biology, general physics, and perhaps a little bit of chemistry would go a long way.

At the middle and high school level, a teacher with at least a fair when do you want to eat your thing?, post high school background, would go a long way towards getting us up to a level where we're really teaching science. The lack of understanding of how science works, along with an over-reliance on the Internet, likely is the cause of many of these problems. I do not permit my students to do papers or assignments relying solely on online sources. My opening tirade when school begins is one on the unreliability of online sources, many do not appreciate the fact that anyone can put anything on the Internet, true or not. While we do an excellent job with basic reading skills, basic math, skills, and many of our students write quite well, science education is where we really do not do a very good job in general.

Biology is the most rote-learning of all the science subjects. But it has also shifted drastically in the last generation or two. When I was studying biology in HS there was a lot of classification. So collecting butterflies or insects, pressing leaves and flowers, doing dichotomous keys, and learning all the phylums and classes of things. That is how a lot of biology was done 100-150 years ago. You'd go on expeditions, shoot and collect everything in sight, then spend the next 10 years sorting it all out in the museum. Museum basements and sub-basements are still full of all that old stuff. Today the focus is on either the bigger scale (ecosystems and ecology) or the micro scale with molecular biology and genetics. So you have to understand chemistry before biology.

Chemistry and Physics have not changed as much over time. But the best way to learn is by doing. So lots of labs, collecting data, and making sense of it. And that takes equipment and the knowledge of how to get kids from point A to point B when they are trying to put together their own investigations. And it also takes a lot of knowledge to know which labs and activities work and which don't. Most of the activities in text books are garbage. You have to really invest time in the science teaching community to build up a repertoire.

The big mainstream Mennonite high schools are pretty much just generic private schools these days. So they have whatever science instruction their size and budgets allow. I have no idea what goes on in small rural single-congregation conservative Mennonite schools. I've never been in one.

As for training. Every state in the country has continuing education requirements for teachers. Typically you might need 100 continuing education hours every 5 years to renew your license. So there is a plethora of workshops and training opportunities in the summers that are put on by regional education centers and schools of education. Much of it free or close to free. Mostly it is public school teachers attending because they need to keep up their licenses. But anyone can sign up and attend. A lot of it these days is also online.

[R7ehr]

Perfect storm of the biggest measles outbreak in years.

... because of the state of science education of 0.1% of the population, which is incidentally better than state of education of the rest of the population (when measured with things like basic literacy, basic math, and so on)?

Yes, but the state of science education in our communities is poor to nonexistent in many cases. Only the really large schools do a good job. (Shout out to Josh G. here) I am a science teacher in a conservative Mennonite school, for the last five years. I go to conferences whenever I can. I have taught "breakouts" at a few of these. We need to face the fact that we cannot teach science simply by having a teacher, recite a textbook. In conservative, Mennonite schools lab facilities ranged from fairly good in many, really large high schools, to completely non-existent, with a homeroom teacher attempting to teach science. While they make a valiant effort, seldom ever is the job particularly good..

I have been a houseguest in a number of Mennonite homes, and typically when they find out I'm a teacher I wind up getting shown various problems that they are having difficulty understanding. I have seen at least two cases where teachers in conservative Mennonite schools were unable to teach their 10th graders how to do the falling bodies, acceleration problem correctly. Now this may not seem like much, but it's likely indicative of the rest of the curriculum they are getting. My answer this is we really need to up our game, I would start sending some of our teachers over the summer to get further education, a local community college is programs in general biology, general physics, and perhaps a little bit of chemistry would go a long way.

At the middle and high school level, a teacher with at least a fair when do you want to eat your thing?, post high school background, would go a long way towards getting us up to a level where we're really teaching science. The lack of understanding of how science works, along with an over-reliance on the Internet, likely is the cause of many of these problems. I do not permit my students to do papers or assignments relying solely on online sources. My opening tirade when school begins is one on the unreliability of online sources, many do not appreciate the fact that anyone can put anything on the Internet, true or not. While we do an excellent job with basic reading skills, basic math, skills, and many of our students write quite well, science education is where we really do not do a very good job in general.

My science education was so quaint that I don’t even know when I want to eat my thing.