Major attack on Israel by Hamas

[Ernie]

Hamas is committed to the removal of the Israel state.

I don't see anything about this problem that can be connected to God's promise to Israel, and my sympathies (whatever I may have) are not based on prophesies about Israel. I just know people there, have visited there a couple times, and I come away thinking that regarding Gaza, Israel has been forced into the defensive position because of Hamas.

So what if Israel would give Gaza residents who agree to not commit violence against Israelis, to live in Israel? Those who want Israel removed could stay in Gaza.

So they could continue to use Gaza as a staging ground for terrorism and intafadas?

The kingdoms of this world would need to decide how to treat them.

[Ernie]

So what if Israel would give Gaza residents who agree to not commit violence against Israelis, to live in Israel? Those who want Israel removed could stay in Gaza.

I’m not sure exactly what you’re asking. It would indeed be a strange Hamas member, to be truly committed to the annihilation of Israel, and agree not to commit violence against Israelis. That might take some convincing.

As I understand, only 50% of Gazans support Hamas and perhaps more than 50% would have discouraged attacking Israel if they could have done so anonymously. I'm quite sure that the few Christians in Gaza are not behind Hamas. I don't think these nonviolent folks should be confined to an area 6 miles by 25 miles for decades with no room to expand. The Jews and others came and took away their land and forced them onto a "reserve". The US did the same thing but eventually allowed native Americans to move back onto their land. I think the same should happen in Israel. The parallels between US colonization/pushing native Americans out of their home areas as compared with what is happening in Israel, seems very similar to me.

It is my understanding that Israel does sort of do that. Since 2021 at least, they give some of the Palestinians work permits that allow them to come and go from both the West Bank and Gaza. And last year, they increased the number. And it is my understanding that Israel was set to increase the number of work permits this year too. I don’t know though, what the process is, if any, for these people to live permanently in Israel. It would seem like a reasonable progression to go from work permits, to permanent residency.
But now Hamas has probably torpedoed any progress on this matter.

From my limited perspective, that was a nice first step by the Israelis.

[Ernie]

I think this is the wrong assessment - Israel is not and never had been committed to the annihilation of the Palestinians. Whereas, the Palestinians as recently as Saturday publicly reiterated their 70-year old commitment to wiping Israel from the face of the earth. A useful heuristic for me in a situation like this is: If one side is committed to the genocidal destruction of the other; that side is the wrong side.”

We can both sides this all day but when it comes down to it one side:
Rapes
Kidnaps
Holds Hostages for Ransom
Targets civilians
Is committed to the complete destruction of the other

Israel has done a lot wrong, but they’re not that. If they fail to stop Hamas they will have failed at their function as a state.

I agree with you HK and think that you make an important distinction. I think it is correct to call Hamas a terrorist party.

My problem with Israel is that when they get angry, they punish innocent persons along with the bad.

[mike]

I think this is the wrong assessment - Israel is not and never had been committed to the annihilation of the Palestinians. Whereas, the Palestinians as recently as Saturday publicly reiterated their 70-year old commitment to wiping Israel from the face of the earth. A useful heuristic for me in a situation like this is: If one side is committed to the genocidal destruction of the other; that side is the wrong side.”

We can both sides this all day but when it comes down to it one side:
Rapes
Kidnaps
Holds Hostages for Ransom
Targets civilians
Is committed to the complete destruction of the other

Israel has done a lot wrong, but they’re not that. If they fail to stop Hamas they will have failed at their function as a state.

I agree with you HK and think that you make an important distinction. I think it is correct to call Hamas a terrorist party.

My problem with Israel is that when they get angry, they punish innocent persons along with the bad.

That's what war always does, doesn't it? I think that Israel tries to avoid civilian casualties during retributive strikes, but everybody knows they cannot completely be avoided.

[MaxPC]

I think this is the wrong assessment - Israel is not and never had been committed to the annihilation of the Palestinians. Whereas, the Palestinians as recently as Saturday publicly reiterated their 70-year old commitment to wiping Israel from the face of the earth. A useful heuristic for me in a situation like this is: If one side is committed to the genocidal destruction of the other; that side is the wrong side.”

We can both sides this all day but when it comes down to it one side:
Rapes
Kidnaps
Holds Hostages for Ransom
Targets civilians
Is committed to the complete destruction of the other

Israel has done a lot wrong, but they’re not that. If they fail to stop Hamas they will have failed at their function as a state.

Spot on and amen.

[Josh]

For all who supported Black Lives Matter,they just announced that they "stand with Hamas"

There is a difference between “stand with Hamas” and a position such as my own, which is that hundreds of Palestinian children shouldn’t have bombs dropped on them.

[Valerie]

For all who supported Black Lives Matter,they just announced that they "stand with Hamas"

There is a difference between “stand with Hamas” and a position such as my own, which is that hundreds of Palestinian children shouldn’t have bombs dropped on them.

Agreed. War is evil no matter what. In fact it is why many I talk to won't believe because of the God they read about in Okd Testament. It was no worse what He demanded in some ways and people take issue with it. They cannot reconcile a God of love with the history of OT commands of killing every man woman and child God called gmfor

[Josh]

For all who supported Black Lives Matter,they just announced that they "stand with Hamas"

There is a difference between “stand with Hamas” and a position such as my own, which is that hundreds of Palestinian children shouldn’t have bombs dropped on them.

Agreed. War is evil no matter what. In fact it is why many I talk to won't believe because of the God they read about in Okd Testament. It was no worse what He demanded in some ways and people take issue with it. They cannot reconcile a God of love with the history of OT commands of killing every man woman and child God called gmfor

God commanded that pagans with detestable idolatrous practices so wicked I’d rather not type them here be wiped out… yet be also offered a path of salvation to those who sought righteousness, such as the harlot Rahab.

[MaxPC]

I think this is the wrong assessment - Israel is not and never had been committed to the annihilation of the Palestinians. Whereas, the Palestinians as recently as Saturday publicly reiterated their 70-year old commitment to wiping Israel from the face of the earth. A useful heuristic for me in a situation like this is: If one side is committed to the genocidal destruction of the other; that side is the wrong side.”

We can both sides this all day but when it comes down to it one side:
Rapes
Kidnaps
Holds Hostages for Ransom
Targets civilians
Is committed to the complete destruction of the other

Israel has done a lot wrong, but they’re not that. If they fail to stop Hamas they will have failed at their function as a state.

Spot on and amen.

Furthermore: Israel has texted civilians in Gaza warning them to flee south to Egypt as it prepares for an all-out ground assault to "crush" Hamas.

[Josh]

Trouble is. The border at Egypt is closed. 2 million Gazans have nowhere to go.