Russia Invades Ukraine 2022

[temporal1]

Yes, and suffering in war happens in part because of supplying massive amounts of arms.

The myth is that there is a “bad side” and “good side” and that it is OK to provide munitions and assistance to help the “good side”.

After America decided to invade Iraq and Afghanistan, and so many people stayed silent or supported that invasion, it is the height of hypocrisy to think America can somehow choose the right side again and once again ship massive amounts of weapons to a war zone.

One good thing to do is diplomacy and negotiation to prevent violent conflicts. We got to see what that was like in 2017-2021.

Just War Theory is extremely valuable in the U.S.
Lessons learned from The World Wars (Just Wars) versus Vietnam conflict/war (unpopular war): Mainstream media sells the plan.
Politicians have learned, U.S. citizens are noisy, so .. control the pesky noise. (Now, thru media, schools, healthcare - control the dialogue.) It’s huge, and it’s effective.

Listening to this video report, i wondered, are these people following MN?! -
(i wish they offered a time breakdown of discussed topics.)

“Putin just EXPOSED the NATO liberal plan to destroy Ukraine” | Redacted with Clayton Morris / -39min

Description:

Peace? What's that?
Western leaders continue to reject the idea of peace talks in Ukraine.

Meanwhile, the United States and South Korea fired five missiles around North Korea on Wednesday as a “show of force.”
They are said to have crashed into a military base and have caused no casualties. This was in response to North Korea’s missiles that were fired on Tuesday. This is the 23rd missile that North Korea has launched this year.

Remembering March 2022:
At about 29min, reviewing former dialogue between Ukraine+Russia! -
Elon Musk’s 4 point proposal!

[hmm. i’m not alone in marveling at similarites, Elon Musk’s recent proposal/March talks.]
i’m sure Ukraine-Russia resolution (Putin+Z were in contact) it was brought up on forum, and, dismissed, as they’re describing.
The West seemed uninterested, escalation has followed, along with talk of protracted war.

i agree, biden, the U.S., cannot claim “distance” from hot wars while supplying BILLIONS in military aid, tech, support,
AND full HAWKISH rhetoric - directed against Putin+Russia. If there’s a line, it’s a mighty thin one. One that might be difficult to “translate.”

The eagerness and readiness of the U.S. to fight adds to questions of what has the West been up to, before Feb 24?? -
and, what do they want out of this??

The word, “resolution” has been missing from this admin, and/or mainstream media.

[Bootstrap]

As a Westerner and an Anabaptist, it’s my duty to speak out against my own Western country’s warmongering behaviour, not find ways to go along with it.

But the United States did not invade Ukraine, and it was not attacking Russia. If you want to speak out against warmongering and military aggression and war crimes in Ukraine, that's Putin.

If you want to stand up for the victims of war, that's the Ukranians. And I think the Kingdom of God approach is to think about how to help refugees and other victims of war, not to justify the military aggressor or blame the victims.

And let's not swallow Putin's propaganda whole. When you see this kind of clickbait, think twice, slow down, ask yourself who is producing and spreading this propaganda and why:

“Putin just EXPOSED the NATO liberal plan to destroy Ukraine”

Or just stay away from it. We don't have to take sides in the war to care about the victims and seek ways to help them.

[Bootstrap]

Really, if we could express that common ground more clearly and simply, I think you would see a very different response coming from me. It would give me a lot more to agree with.

Mike’s post below was/is originally in this thread, Page 84, i shared it in Neto’s thread, which is a source for Ukraine missions:

This is a sweet video. i’ve viewed a few times:

Friends of ours in Poland posted the following video a few days ago on the Ukrainian refugee crisis. Their lives have been transformed overnight as they have been plunged into this situation, and their work is worth supporting.

Yes, I very much appreciated Mike's post.

These are the kinds of things we should be doing as Kingdom Christians.

[temporal1]

i haven’t seen or heard from RON PAUL in a long while.
This video is interesting - to the very end. He speaks of racism toward the end.
He’s not a fan of “fighting racism with racism,” and the predictable problems of government “solutions” that often make everything worse. He uses an example of Monkeypox vaccine availability in San Francisco.

RonPaulLibertyReport / “Elon Musk's Ukraine Peace Proposal Slammed By Ukraine Officials” / -30min

Description:
“Tesla and Space-X chief Elon Musk got a taste of the vitriol delved out to anyone who challenges the Ukraine narrative,
as his Tweeted proposal to begin discussions on ending the Russia-Ukraine war was incinerated by pro-Ukraine Twitter users.

Ukraine's president himself got into the act, slamming the very person who provided Ukraine with Starlink technology to save Ukraine's Internet.

Also today, former Pentagon senior official Col. Doug Macgregor
on who might be responsible for Nordstream sabotage.”

^^ i prefer transcripts, or, at least time stamps for different points discussed.

Found in Comments:

Audrey Lin WROTE:
3 days ago
Ukraine had 8 years to build goodwill with the people in Donbass and Crimean regions.
Instead, they cut off the water supply and fired rockets at them.
How do you think they'll be treated if Ukraine regains control of the region?

??

[Falco Underhill]

So if the object of this war is to break up Russia by NATO globalists, I think it's safe to the new state of Russia (whatever form it takes) will be in accordance with the whole new world order thing?

Some people say Putin is KGB willing partner in all this. The Soviet Union state was only meant to be a temporary stepping stone to world socialism, anyway. (Socialist literature spoke openly of this as far back as the 1930's)

The so-called fall of the Soviet Union and its acceptance of Democracy was all a show to get to the next step: worldwide socialism.

At the fall of the Soviet Union in 1989, the KGB remained fully in control of Russia and was never really dismantled. Putin is KGB player in cahoots with "nationalists" with globalist ambitions.

I have never been able to wrap my head around the idea that Putin is that smart, just playing a game, hoodwinking us all. (His arguments in favor of Christianity and the failure of socialism are so intelligent and convincing. Is it really possible that someone can play a game like this so successfully?)

However, if that's what's going on, this whole thing was predicted in a book called The Perestroika Deception (1995). Written by a defector of the Soviet Union, it describes how the "fall" of the Soviet Union was all planned and just for show.

Right now, we might all just be watching another part of the show.

Okay, am I nuts for thinking this a possibility?

[Falco Underhill]

Addendum: it was supposed to read "I think it's safe to say the new state of Russia ..."

[Ken]

So if the object of this war is to break up Russia by NATO globalists...

The actual objective of the war was a genocidal attempt to erase Ukraine as an independent state and culture separate from Russia. In other words, push the boundaries of the Russian empire back up to the border of Poland. There are endless writings and speeches including from Putin himself that confirm this was the ultimate Russian objective of the war. Every country on earth from the US to China pled with Putin not to invade. He ignored them all.

Although the war is still raging, it is clear he has utterly failed in that objective. And what standing he had in the world prior to February 24, 2022 is slipping from his grasp. He has single-handedly strengthened NATO and made it relevant again. Finland and Sweden have joined NATO. Every Central European member of NATO is ramping up military spending and cooperation. Every central and western European nation is investing billions in a mad scramble to rid themselves of Russian oil and gas.

At the same time, with Russia preoccupied by Ukraine, its influence over Central Asia is slipping from its grasp. From Today's NYT: https://www.nytimes.com/2022/10/08/worl ... oviet.html

A Distracted Russia Is Losing Its Grip on Its Old Soviet Sphere: Russia’s domination of Central Asia and the Caucasus region is unraveling as the Kremlin focuses on the war in Ukraine — and border violence is flaring.

With the Kremlin distracted by its flagging war more than 1,500 miles away in Ukraine, Russia’s dominium over its old Soviet empire shows signs of unraveling. Moscow has lost its aura and its grip, creating a disorderly vacuum that previously obedient former Soviet satraps, as well as China, are moving to fill. . . .

Moscow’s security alliance has long been touted by Mr. Putin as Russia’s answer to NATO and an anchor of its role as the dominant (and often domineering) force across vast expanses of the former Soviet Union. But now the bloc is barely functioning. Five of its six members — Armenia, Belarus, Russia, Tajikistan and Kyrgyzstan — have been involved in wars this year, while the sixth, Kazakhstan, has seen violent internal strife.

In response, China is newly asserting itself, while the United States also sees an opening, pressing Kyrgyzstan to sign a new bilateral cooperation agreement. It would replace one scrapped in 2014 after Russian pressure forced the closing of an American air base outside Bishkek that had been set up to fuel warplanes flying over Afghanistan.

“Until Ukraine, China and Russia were not interested in open competition in Central Asia,” said Asel Doolotkeldieva, a senior lecturer at the OSCE Academy in Bishkek, a center for postgraduate studies focused on security issues. “There was a tacit division of labor: security for Russia, economics for China. But Russia is not doing its job anymore. It has shown that it is unable, or unwilling, to protect the region.”

How will this all end? I don't have any better crystal ball than anyone else. I suspect both sides will eventually exhaust themselves and the war will settle some kind of cease fire with a temporary cold border in place wherever the front lines end up. Which might simmer for decades like the Korean DMZ until some future governments eventually come to a final settlement. Some future Russian government will need to make major concessions if it wants to fully rejoin the world economy.

Russia will still exist, but it is rapidly turning itself into Mexico. A medium-size country with a medium-size economy dominated by waste and corruption, and little influence beyond its own borders.

[Falco Underhill]

I was referring to the fact that speakers for NATO currently say no peaceful resolution with Putin will be possible and only Putin out of power and new government institutions installed after Putin's gone will be acceptable to NATO as a resolution to this conflict.

I don't expect you to agree Ken, but I still think the Perestroika Deception theory could explain a lot, no matter what resolution this ultimately comes to.

Of course, you know me, and what a terrible conspiracy theorist I am!

[Ken]

I was referring to the fact that speakers for NATO currently say no peaceful resolution with Putin will be possible and only Putin out of power and new government institutions installed after Putin's gone will be acceptable to NATO as a resolution to this conflict.

I don't expect you to agree Ken, but I still think the Perestroika Deception theory could explain a lot, no matter what resolution this ultimately comes to.

Of course, you know me, and what a terrible conspiracy theorist I am!

Which representatives for NATO are saying this? Can you cite any?

I expect that every single representative of NATO would happy agree that the war would be over tomorrow if Russia decided to withdraw.

[Falco Underhill]

I was referring to the fact that speakers for NATO currently say no peaceful resolution with Putin will be possible and only Putin out of power and new government institutions installed after Putin's gone will be acceptable to NATO as a resolution to this conflict.

I don't expect you to agree Ken, but I still think the Perestroika Deception theory could explain a lot, no matter what resolution this ultimately comes to.

Of course, you know me, and what a terrible conspiracy theorist I am!

Which representatives for NATO are saying this? Can you cite any?

I expect that every single representative of NATO would happy agree that the war would be over tomorrow if Russia decided to withdraw.

I was actually referring to the video above by temp.

My apologies, I think I may have only confused issues, even for myself.

My understanding of all this is unclear, yet. It's possible that Russia's strategy is in accordance with something known as "convergence theory." Russia's globalist ambitions and the West's "converge" in globalist agenda's such as the 2030 agenda (a communist agenda) and in this way (theoretically, anyway) America will become subservient to Russian & China's interests.

The conflict between Russia & US over Ukraine is real. (This is where I think I really started to get it all wrong!) The convergence of global interests makes one suspect they're intentionally playing on the same team (that was my confusion!) but that might be very misleading! According to this Perestroika Deception theory (if I understand it correctly) Russia is still communist (underground) and has been playing America by pretending it isn't, setting up globalist agendas to lure everyone else in, pretending it's all capitalist stuff. (I assume with at least some American policy makers sympathetic to Russian interests.)

So, there really are genuine control issues over who controls Ukraine between the two powers. (Just because they all seem to be on the same globalist page doesn't change that, I guess.)

I may post less about this rather than putting my foot in my mouth again!

Sorry if I've confused matters!