Elon Musk. Twitter. Babylon Bee.

[Robert]

There are plenty of Elon Musk fanboys out there who literally do worship him. The internet is full of them.

None are on MN. Bootstrap asked about hero worship HERE. I was responding to that.

[Ernie]

There are lots of ways to address social security.

1. We could increase the earnings cap such that income above $168,000 is subject to the social security tax
2. We could expand the forms of income subject to the tax so it isn’t just wages that are taxed but also passive income such as dividends and capital gains which mostly accrue to the wealthy
3. We can increase immigration which will increase the ration of workers to retirees
4. We can partially fund social security through other revenue sources such as a corporate income tax surcharge,
5. We can cut benefits to existing retirees directly or indirectly through methods like reducing the COLA formula
6. We can cut benefits to future retires through things like raising the retirement age

Only #5 and 6 are benefit cuts. #1–4 are revenue increases.

Curiously Republicans and the project 2025 authors don’t recommend any revenue increases. They only recommend cuts.

I find it interesting, but very sad that advanced civilizations find ways to oppress the poor by shrouding it in legal policies.
At the end of the day, it is the poor getting poorer and the rich getting richer - same as in every other era whenever the rich believe they
1. are endowed by their Creator to live luxuriously while Lazarus at their gate suffers.
or
2. they lose heart and soul and don't even try to justify their luxury

Either way, Lazarus sits at the gate and begs.

Sometime ago someone posted a link to a graph showing the disparity between the rich and poor, or between CEOs and the low income wage earners. In the early 1900's, the gulf was huge, then it narrowed during the 70's, and now it has returned to the 1900's level of disparity. Can anyone again point me to a graph like this?

[Bootstrap]

Which of the following reflect Christian values or Mennonite values? Which of the following are trustworthy sources of truth?

1. Elon Musk
2. Twitter
3. Babylon Bee

Are they worthy of hero worship here?

Hero worship? Where?

Please explain the difference between this thread and hero worship. Are you not promoting them as heroes here?

Here are some things that look like hero worship to me:

1. Relentlessly promoting them.
2. Identifying with them, strong emotional attachment.
3. Taking it personally when they are criticized.
4. Portraying them as the heroes who will defeat the enemy.
5. Ongoing exaggerated language, portraying people as basically superhuman, the Übermensch.

Yes, people then say, "Oh, I just prefer them to the alternative." But I don't see that in these posts. I often prefer one politician or source of information to another. I don't think I ever glorify them to this extent.

[JohnL]

I find it interesting, but very sad that advanced civilizations find ways to oppress the poor by shrouding it in legal policies.
At the end of the day, it is the poor getting poorer and the rich getting richer - same as in every other era whenever the rich believe they
1. are endowed by their Creator to live luxuriously while Lazarus at their gate suffers.
or
2. they lose heart and soul and don't even try to justify their luxury

Either way, Lazarus sits at the gate and begs.

Sometime ago someone posted a link to a graph showing the disparity between the rich and poor, or between CEOs and the low income wage earners. In the early 1900's, the gulf was huge, then it narrowed during the 70's, and now it has returned to the 1900's level of disparity. Can anyone again point me to a graph like this?

The first Christians didn't depend on the Roman Empire government to take care of the Lazarus- type individuals. They went out and did it themselves.
Making government bigger doesn’t help the poor. We’ve seen decades and decades of programs that accomplished nothing except to raise taxes and impoverish the middle classes while providing a front for money laundering politicians. LBJ’s War on Poverty in Appalachia did absolutely nothing for the locals except line the pockets of politicians. The poverty is still here and the money big gov threw at it disappeared.
I’m firmly in the camp of cut taxes and let local churches minister to Lazarus. It worked pretty well for the Earliest Christians. When Jesus said we’ll always have the poor I see that as a challenge to Christians to personally minister to the poor whether it’s material goods or poverty of the soul and mind. It’s an opportunity to share the Gospel which big gov won’t do.

[JohnH]

I find it interesting, but very sad that advanced civilizations find ways to oppress the poor by shrouding it in legal policies.
At the end of the day, it is the poor getting poorer and the rich getting richer - same as in every other era whenever the rich believe they
1. are endowed by their Creator to live luxuriously while Lazarus at their gate suffers.
or
2. they lose heart and soul and don't even try to justify their luxury

Either way, Lazarus sits at the gate and begs.

Sometime ago someone posted a link to a graph showing the disparity between the rich and poor, or between CEOs and the low income wage earners. In the early 1900's, the gulf was huge, then it narrowed during the 70's, and now it has returned to the 1900's level of disparity. Can anyone again point me to a graph like this?

One wholesome thing a society can do is decide to do less trade with places that use practices that oppress workers and the poor. One method is using the tariff so that such countries can't take advantage of slave labor and effectively it "export" to wealthier countries. I would prefer to have more options to not buy from places that use such slave labor, but it is very difficult to run a business that doesn't import stuff from China, Vietnam, Bangladesh, and other such places.

One way Christians can have direct impact is to choose to make their own clothes (including for men). Some of the worst practices are in the garment industry. Yet when I observe moderate-conservative Mennonites, they seem very committed to trying to buy their clothes instead from stores. I think this shows the moral bankruptcy that exists in the moderate-conservative sphere.

[Robert]

1. Relentlessly promoting them.

Stating the failures of his parenthood?

2. Identifying with them, strong emotional attachment.

Identifying with a multibillionaire who makes cars and rockets?

3. Taking it personally when they are criticized.

Responding with a different perspective is not taking anything personally.

4. Portraying them as the heroes who will defeat the enemy.

? Where on MN is this done?

5. Ongoing exaggerated language, portraying people as basically superhuman, the Übermensch.

Don't even know what Übermensch means. Care to speak English for better understanding? There is a lot of satire and humor that gets added. Most of us just snicker a little and go on with our lives.

I am wondering if you are so anti Trump that anything that seems a little positive becomes exaggerated in your view? I am not trying to tell you how you are acting or feeling. Just trying to make sense of such a different perception of what I see here. The years of Obama and Biden I did not see the vitriol from those who opposed him. I would see some posts and comments, but nothing at this level of distain. I can assure you, I felt it, especially for Biden, but did not feel the need to come in and post daily about the evils I saw.

[JimFoxvog]

The US Constitution guarantees that We the People OWN things and the government has not right to our possessions. We are the ruling body, not the government.

It doesn't come to mind where you find that guarantee in the Constitution. The Constitution does establish an income tax. (16th Amendment)

[Robert]

The US Constitution guarantees that We the People OWN things and the government has not right to our possessions. We are the ruling body, not the government.

It doesn't come to mind where you find that guarantee in the Constitution. The Constitution does establish an income tax. (16th Amendment)

First 10 Amendments were to limit government. Our rights are endowed by our Creator, not government. The core of the Constitution and the Amendments is for limited government. If i am paying over 50% taxes, that is not very limited.

[Grace]

One way Christians can have direct impact is to choose to make their own clothes (including for men). Some of the worst practices are in the garment industry. Yet when I observe moderate-conservative Mennonites, they seem very committed to trying to buy their clothes instead from stores. I think this shows the moral bankruptcy that exists in the moderate-conservative sphere.

From one who hates to shop and loves to sew, I can agree. However, I often wonder where the fabrics come from and assume they come from China and other Asian countries. There is a local company who buys all their fabric in the U.S. and then prints it. However, the prices are a little too high.


https://littlecocalico.com/browse-desig ... ollections

[JimFoxvog]

What always puzzles me is how anyone’s property rights are recognized and have value in the absence of any government. Property rights exist because governments exist. Without government, the deed I hold to my property that is recorded in the country records office is just a meaningless piece of paper. And without the infrastructure provided by the government in terms of streets, water, sewer, electricity, fire protection, police protection, public schools, etc. my lot has little intrinsic value.

Not according to the US Constitution. They are inalienable rights given by our Creator.

Where do you find that in the Constitution?