I was making the point that you (or anyone of us) are no more able to "speak for the white community" than an outlier like Candace Owens is able to "speak for the black community"
If we acknowledge that their are diverse voices in the white community then we should similarly acknowledge that there are diverse voices in the black community and not restrict ourselves to just listening to those who tell us what we want to hear.
Honestly, this entire thread is a little bit misguided. Would we have a similar thread titled "Who speaks for the Menno community?" or would we acknowledge up front that the entire notion of someone speaking for the entire Menno community is ridiculous. Unless maybe it is Donald Kraybill
Right. I get it. I think Boot's point in the thread was to explore the fact that folks like CO et al, don't speak for the black community. And when there is toward 90% coherence/unanimity in how the Black community feels about social questions, we ought to hold the outliers pretty loosely. To me that point, is a point worth making. And our brothers and sisters like the Pollards, are really hurt/frustrated by white people who don't bother asking them how they experience systemic racism in society (and the CA church), but meanwhile, send around clips of CO, or David, or the others that articulate beliefs that many white people have.
So for the thread to be disparaged as "ridiculous" is really only something a white person would say. Which is why I pushed PC on it.
I was making the point that you (or anyone of us) are no more able to "speak for the white community" than an outlier like Candace Owens is able to "speak for the black community"
If we acknowledge that their are diverse voices in the white community then we should similarly acknowledge that there are diverse voices in the black community and not restrict ourselves to just listening to those who tell us what we want to hear.
Honestly, this entire thread is a little bit misguided. Would we have a similar thread titled "Who speaks for the Menno community?" or would we acknowledge up front that the entire notion of someone speaking for the entire Menno community is ridiculous. Unless maybe it is Donald Kraybill
Right. I get it. I think Boot's point in the thread was to explore the fact that folks like CO et al, don't speak for the black community. And when there is toward 90% coherence/unanimity in how the Black community feels about social questions, we ought to hold the outliers pretty loosely. To me that point, is a point worth making. And our brothers and sisters like the Pollards, are really hurt/frustrated by white people who don't bother asking them how they experience systemic racism in society (and the CA church), but meanwhile, send around clips of CO, or David, or the others that articulate beliefs that many white people have.
So for the thread to be disparaged as "ridiculous" is really only something a white person would say. Which is why I pushed PC on it.
I agree with you entirely. I was just making the point a little more ineptly I guess!
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Ken wrote:And when there is toward 90% coherence/unanimity in how the Black community feels about social questions, we ought to hold the outliers pretty loosely.
My whole purpose here is to show that feelings are not facts. We should be aware of fats. It may not eliminate our feelings, but they should be at least considered when we express our feelings.
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Try hard not to offend. Try harder not to be offended.
I think I am funnier than I really am.
Ken wrote:And when there is toward 90% coherence/unanimity in how the Black community feels about social questions, we ought to hold the outliers pretty loosely.
My whole purpose here is to show that feelings are not facts. We should be aware of fats. It may not eliminate our feelings, but they should be at least considered when we express our feelings.
Let's also not forget about "Alternative Facts!"
-Kellyanne Conway
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
I was making the point that you (or anyone of us) are no more able to "speak for the white community" than an outlier like Candace Owens is able to "speak for the black community"
If we acknowledge that their are diverse voices in the white community then we should similarly acknowledge that there are diverse voices in the black community and not restrict ourselves to just listening to those who tell us what we want to hear.
Honestly, this entire thread is a little bit misguided. Would we have a similar thread titled "Who speaks for the Menno community?" or would we acknowledge up front that the entire notion of someone speaking for the entire Menno community is ridiculous. Unless maybe it is Donald Kraybill
Right. I get it. I think Boot's point in the thread was to explore the fact that folks like CO et al, don't speak for the black community. And when there is toward 90% coherence/unanimity in how the Black community feels about social questions, we ought to hold the outliers pretty loosely. To me that point, is a point worth making. And our brothers and sisters like the Pollards, are really hurt/frustrated by white people who don't bother asking them how they experience systemic racism in society (and the CA church), but meanwhile, send around clips of CO, or David, or the others that articulate beliefs that many white people have.
So for the thread to be disparaged as "ridiculous" is really only something a white person would say. Which is why I pushed PC on it.
joshuabgood wrote:The fact that the CA world resists mask wearing so vociferously is a tell for one of our cultural proclivities, that we have been discussing in other threads. Same root though...hint, it's the beam I mentioned to GaryK that I see in our circles. =)
May I ask why you are so hard on the CA world in regard to the beam you keep mentioning? I'm pretty sure the vast majority of CA's would disagree with you. Why should people listen to you if the majority say you don't speak for them?
joshuabgood wrote:The fact that the CA world resists mask wearing so vociferously is a tell for one of our cultural proclivities, that we have been discussing in other threads. Same root though...hint, it's the beam I mentioned to GaryK that I see in our circles. =)
May I ask why you are so hard on the CA world in regard to the beam you keep mentioning? I'm pretty sure the vast majority of CA's would disagree with you. Why should people listen to you if the majority say you don't speak for them?
Wow, Thanks Gary. You made my point better than I could!
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Sometime there is something really unhealthy about our desires. As Robert said:
Robert wrote:We should be aware of fats. It may not eliminate our feelings, but they should be at least considered when we express our feelings.
Amen! Especially when we consider our feelings of hunger, our appetites. To many of us don’t even look at the label, at best the total calories are considered occasionally.
Some folks don’t even know that there are “good” and “bad” fats.
But I’m not sure how this ties to the thread topic.
joshuabgood wrote:The fact that the CA world resists mask wearing so vociferously is a tell for one of our cultural proclivities, that we have been discussing in other threads. Same root though...hint, it's the beam I mentioned to GaryK that I see in our circles. =)
May I ask why you are so hard on the CA world in regard to the beam you keep mentioning? I'm pretty sure the vast majority of CA's would disagree with you. Why should people listen to you if the majority say you don't speak for them?
Wow, Thanks Gary. You made my point better than I could!
On the one hand to insist that we listen to the majority of black people because they understand their experience much better than a very small minority of black people and then on the other hand expect us to listen to a very small minority of conservative Anabaptists because the majority of CA's apparently don't really understand their own experiences leaves me scratching my head.
And let me be quick to say that I am in no way endorsing people like Candace Owens here. I'm just wondering what criteria needs to be met in order to be worthy of being listened to if we find ourselves in the minority on any given issue.
