Seattle’s (former?) Capitol Hill neighborhood

[Judas Maccabeus]

Looks like the jig is up. Mayor is telling them to get out. I guess the shootings were a bit too much.

J.M.

She’s promised to do it without force or using the police - I wish her the best.

I'd suggest she send a bill to the protestors to pay for the water, sewer, and electrical services provided by the city at least. Maybe even the lost tax revenue by the businesses they have shut down. With a warning these services will be shut down within a couple days upon default of payment. And then do it. Someone has to work to pay to maintain these services while these protestors even the "peaceful ones" deface, abuse, and take for granted the work of others they disrespect while being supported by them.

I have been wondering all along if any of these people have jobs. I suspect not, no one has that much vacation.

J.M.

[Josh]

Taxpayer-funded unemployment of $600/week plus half of whatever your wages were.

[Robert]

Watching CHOP being dismantled this morning.

[Pelerin]

Well now that it’s over, I’ll drop in a half-formed thought I’ve been rolling around:

Something in my Anabaptist blood appreciates when people take their principles and try to start living out the alternative society they want to see. We have more than our fair share of communal movements and I think a lot of us suspect the Hutterites are on to something, even if we’re skeptical that we can actually make it work in reality.

So I hope the way CHAZ/CHOP ended tragically causes people to reflect. There was some bad stuff, there was some dumb stuff, but there were also some good ideals and I hope they get turned into something constructive.

There’s a Münster analogy here somewhere, but I can’t quite land it.

[Ken]

Well now that it’s over, I’ll drop in a half-formed thought I’ve been rolling around:

Something in my Anabaptist blood appreciates when people take their principles and try to start living out the alternative society they want to see. We have more than our fair share of communal movements and I think a lot of us suspect the Hutterites are on to something, even if we’re skeptical that we can actually make it work in reality.

So I hope the way CHAZ/CHOP ended tragically causes people to reflect. There was some bad stuff, there was some dumb stuff, but there were also some good ideals and I hope they get turned into something constructive.

There’s a Münster analogy here somewhere, but I can’t quite land it.

I think the answer is that forming a deliberate alternative community is something difficult to do even in the best of circumstances when you can closely control who you are associating with. It is downright impossible when you have to deal with any and all crazies who decide to show up and have no idea who is joining with you and what their motives are. Even if the CHAZ leaders had the best of intentions, the whole project was doomed to fail from the start because they basically had no control over who was joining them or anything else. In fact it wasn't even clear who the leaders were. And the place was a magnet for every crazy wannabe brawler type from all over the city. Anarchy was the predictable result.

[Josh]

Anarchy was the result because it was the goal of the people who started it.

[Ken]

Anarchy was the result because it was the goal of the people who started it.

To be fair, there were plenty of naive idealists who believed they were creating something good. But because they had no control over who joined them it only took a nanosecond for anarchists and other violent, malicious, and destructive types to crash their party.

The result was entirely predictable and inevitable. It is hard enough to do effective governance when you have a tightly controlled group of representatives operating under pre-established rules like say a school board or church. And even those are often dysfunctional. It is utterly impossible to have effective governance when you start with no rules and have no control over who is participating.

[justme]

funny how that works. get rid of something because there is too much control, but then blame not enough control for the failure of the replacement.


people don't usually try to tear down a system or the boss because they don't like that control. they try to tear it down so that they themselves can be the ones with the new control. they don't want to be under the control of someone, so they phrase it as standing up for the lesser guy. when in reality, what they really want, is to be the boss.

[temporal1]

Page 5:

An insurrection that takes over a police station is not a “few protesters”.
The left and Democrats need to get their act together and control their radical fringe.

Or, don’t, hey, I don’t care. It’s your politics, not mine.

I think armed insurrections are a bad idea. Really bad.
Bad crooked police departments are bad too, but armed insurrections are even worse.

Yes.

Above:

Anarchy was the result because it was the goal of the people who started it.

Yes.

funny how that works. get rid of something because there is too much control, but then blame not enough control for the failure of the replacement.

people don't usually try to tear down a system or the boss because they don't like that control.
they try to tear it down so that they themselves can be the ones with the new control.
they don't want to be under the control of someone, so they phrase it as standing up for the lesser guy. when in reality, what they really want, is to be the boss.

Just saw this. Correct, and ugly.

The really awful part of this current mess is how ignorant, unprepared, inept the rioters are.
They have the delusional idea that they can overturn and acquire the system - without losing any benefits of the system they just destroyed. One example in Seattle, they banished first responders, then, when violence erupted were astonished first responders were not there - as usual.

It’s a pathetic reflection of the idiocy involved.

Clearly, if these folks get what they want, in part or whole, THEY will be filled with regrets.
“They know not what they do,” 21st Century style. i mean, they know-not anything.
The results of academia at its worst. “It looks good on paper” .. ..

And, the lack of fathers involved with their families -
‘cause, in general, fathers teach a lot of BASIC common sense, in ways we mothers can’t quite match.

An example of (my father’s wisdom):
“Never swim out into a lake - further than you know you can swim back.”

i presume he would advise,
“don’t overthrow a system, while expecting that system to take care of you, same as always.”
or, in this case, “better than ever.” (the central goal is: “more for me.”)

these particular rioters have high expectations, because they’ve received so much without learning gratitude for it. (we all have.)

as a culture, we’ve forgotten the importance of gratitude - for simply waking up each new day.
a big loss. it can be relearned. unfortunately, the deepest gratitude results after hardship.

the world teaches victimhood / false power. Jesus teaches gratitude / authentic power.

[temporal1]

Watching CHOP being dismantled this morning.

Anarchy was the result because it was the goal of the people who started it.

“Rantz: At least 118 Seattle police officers left department in mass exodus”
https://mynorthwest.com/2236407/rantz-s ... ce-exodus/

A new forum thread on gratitude/gratefulness:

“Practicing gratefullness“
http://forum.mennonet.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=3196