CAM Molestation Issue

[Beeply]

Todays Scripture Reading:
Joh 8:1 ¶ Jesus went unto the mount of Olives.
2 And early in the morning he came again into the temple, and all the people came unto him; and he sat down, and taught them.
3 And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,
4 They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.
5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?
6 This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.
7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.
10 When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

[Szdfan]

Todays Scripture Reading:
Joh 8:1 ¶ Jesus went unto the mount of Olives.
2 And early in the morning he came again into the temple, and all the people came unto him; and he sat down, and taught them.
3 And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,
4 They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.
5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?
6 This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.
7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.
10 When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

We are all sinners, but not all of us are sexual predators. I would not place sexual abuse into the same category as adultery. Are you saying that there isn’t anything we can do about sexual abuse because we’re all sinners?

[Neto]

Todays Scripture Reading:
Joh 8:1 ¶ Jesus went unto the mount of Olives.
2 And early in the morning he came again into the temple, and all the people came unto him; and he sat down, and taught them.
3 And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,
4 They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.
5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?
6 This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.
7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
8 And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
9 And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.
10 When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11 She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.

We are all sinners, but not all of us are sexual predators. I would not place sexual abuse into the same category as adultery. Are you saying that there isn’t anything we can do about sexual abuse because we’re all sinners?

Aside from the inherent statement in Jesus' word in response to this particular situation (and type of sin?), there is also an implication that it is possible to change, to stop the sin, or to BE CHANGED. How would Jesus have responded if it was a sexual predator who had been brought to him? (Not in terms of whether any punishment was called for, but in terms of the "Sin no more" part of his response in this case?)

[hillperson]

This is what Jesus said about those who abuse children in Matthew 18

2Jesus invited a little child to stand among them. 3“Truly I tell you,” He said, “unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. 4Therefore, whoever humbles himself like this little child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5And whoever welcomes a little child like this in My name welcomes Me.

6But if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.

[hillperson]

He goes on and tells predators what to do if they find themselves committing those sins. It is extreme .....

7Woe to the world for the causes of sin. These stumbling blocks must come, but woe to the man through whom they come!

8If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life crippled or lame than to have two hands and two feet and be thrown into the eternal fire. 9And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell.

[hillperson]

Matthew 18:10 also reminds us that justice is coming. The angels are watching and reminding the Father of the offense.

"See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father in heaven.

[Matt]

Our experiences are different. Your experience has clearly been positive and seems to relate much to those on the field. My genuine compassion is towards those missionaries who’ve given their lives out of love and are being negatively affected by this tragedy. To the contrary, the individuals I’ve known are some of those at top levels. You said well, “a few well-meaning but misguided.” The lack of understanding, of what is needed for an individual to change when involved in these actions, is such a gross lack of understanding at so many levels. When this is found in individuals at the top levels it does require a scrutinization of the organization as a whole. Further, what if so many of that era (age group) in our circles have operated in this way for a long time? And what if there are many who want that to change? And, what, or how much, of this is due to An older generation not really understanding the rapid changes that have occurred in our world due to technology and social media, and all the available information?

Don't fall into the trap of thinking the younger generation is so much more enlightened than the older generation. The older generation today (I'm talking the world at large) were the rebels in the 60's and 70's who thought they were so much smarter than their parents. If you don't like the lack of understanding in today's older generation (as a whole, not individually), don't repeat their mistake of thinking they knew more than their parents (again, as a whole, not individually). I say this as one that's part of the younger generation.

My experience has been that the older generation did understand the rapid changes in technology and were warning against where it would lead years ago. Their assessment was dead on and we now see more and more secular sources sounding the same warning.

[Bootstrap]

Our experiences are different. Your experience has clearly been positive and seems to relate much to those on the field. My genuine compassion is towards those missionaries who’ve given their lives out of love and are being negatively affected by this tragedy. To the contrary, the individuals I’ve known are some of those at top levels. You said well, “a few well-meaning but misguided.” The lack of understanding, of what is needed for an individual to change when involved in these actions, is such a gross lack of understanding at so many levels. When this is found in individuals at the top levels it does require a scrutinization of the organization as a whole. Further, what if so many of that era (age group) in our circles have operated in this way for a long time? And what if there are many who want that to change? And, what, or how much, of this is due to An older generation not really understanding the rapid changes that have occurred in our world due to technology and social media, and all the available information?

I met the women who designed the sexual abuse prevention program at a missions organization. She and the people who work with her probably get senior citizen discounts. And the training she designed had insights into technology and social media that were new to me - e.g. the fact that a lot of abuse in the mission field comes from teens watching porn and wanting to act out what they see with their peers or younger children.

In the broader society around us, most children are learning about sex and sexuality from their peers on social media, sometimes in anonymous settings, and have ready access to porn. They can easily find various groups of people exploring sexuality in one way or another online. This raises really important parenting challenges.

But there was a whole lot of underreported sexual abuse in "the good old days" too. And I do think older people are capable of learning these things. On the other hand, I agree that it would be good to have some younger people on these teams too, or at least to make sure the teams are listening to them and learning from them.

[Ambassador]

He goes on and tells predators what to do if they find themselves committing those sins. It is extreme .....

7Woe to the world for the causes of sin. These stumbling blocks must come, but woe to the man through whom they come!

8If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life crippled or lame than to have two hands and two feet and be thrown into the eternal fire. 9And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell.

I don't think Jesus is only speaking to sexual predators here. He is also speaking to any of us us who struggle with or commit other sexual sins. Yes, sexual predation is horribly evil, but lets not apply this verse to them in a way we are not willing to apply it to other sexual sins.

[Josh]

The context is linked to hurting children.

I don’t have a problem with elevating abusing children to be a sin significantly worse than other forms of sexual sin. Whilst all sins are bad, some cause immediate, permanent damage (such as murder).