CAM Molestation Issue

Christian ethics and theology with an Anabaptist perspective
Josh

Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by Josh »

queserasera_2 wrote:Do you actually think that the board of CAM is only meeting with lawyers? :roll: It's been 3 days. Audits are NEVER done quickly if they are thorough.
This was brought up with CAM well before 3 days ago. It just went public 3 days ago.
josh wrote:What’s the point of being part of a religious group whose main purpose seems to be to accomodate and cover up for child molesters?
This is flagrantly dishonest and you know it. Even Trudy doesn't say that.
que, I’m sorry for my grief I express here, but these are feelings I often grapple with. Since becoming a Christian 5 years ago, my life consisted of running into abuser after abuser with attendant cover-ups. The only person who ever got discipline or attention was me, not the abusers.

I thank God every day my life changed for the better in this area when I came to the Holdemans.
As for approaching CAM 3 years ago, it is well known that some at CAM knew about this before 3 years ago. Without knowing with whom you met, what you told them, what evidence you had, what they said back to you, and how much further out the information went, I really can't formulate an opinion on how I feel about their response.
So are you saying you want me to go public? I have spoken to nobody outside of CAM about this and was requested not to. I did not speak publicly here on MN until this was otherwise public.

I did know this:

1. I don’t have a plain last name. Thus, it’s much easier to discount me as not credible.

2. When I learned about this I wasn’t a church member yet. My involvement with things like this made my membership take years.

3. Since I’m divorced, I’m automatically less credible - less credible than a self-confessed abuser.

Given the above, the plain Mennonite world really does start to look like a closed ethnic society dedicated to protecting its own and keeping outsiders out - especially any who dare to speak up against horrific sin and abuse.

What, exactly, is the point of CAM? What’s the point of Jeriah Mast’s church? A disciplined church, accountability, or a pure church where gross sin is exposed and sinners can be led to repentance is NOT the point.
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blackfriar
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Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by blackfriar »

Josh wrote: Given the above, the plain Mennonite world really does start to look like a closed ethnic society dedicated to protecting its own and keeping outsiders out - especially any who dare to speak up against horrific sin and abuse.

What, exactly, is the point of CAM? What’s the point of Jeriah Mast’s church? A disciplined church, accountability, or a pure church where gross sin is exposed and sinners can be led to repentance is NOT the point.
To be fair, sexual abuse and the mishandling of it is a human problem, not just a Mennonite problem. It exists in virtually every kind of institution we know (Penn St, Catholic Church, SBC, Hollywood, the list could go on) Protecting abusers happened in every case.
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Valerie

Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by Valerie »

blackfriar wrote:
Josh wrote: Given the above, the plain Mennonite world really does start to look like a closed ethnic society dedicated to protecting its own and keeping outsiders out - especially any who dare to speak up against horrific sin and abuse.

What, exactly, is the point of CAM? What’s the point of Jeriah Mast’s church? A disciplined church, accountability, or a pure church where gross sin is exposed and sinners can be led to repentance is NOT the point.
To be fair, sexual abuse and the mishandling of it is a human problem, not just a Mennonite problem. It exists in virtually every kind of institution we know (Penn St, Catholic Church, SBC, Hollywood, the list could go on) Protecting abusers happened in every case.
I think that most people who are outsiders/seekers are just 'plain' shocked though because so many feel/felt like they were the last of the 'real' Christians left- and then this.

We must be careful who we put on a pedestal- pride comes before the fall-
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Ken
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Location: Washington State
Affiliation: former MCUSA

Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by Ken »

MaxPC wrote:Southern Baptists are also dealing with their own sex abuse scandal.
https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/r ... 405737001/

https://caringwell.com/wp-content/uploa ... e-2019.pdf

It seems to be an epidemic across denominations and cultures. What do you think is causing it?
What common denominator do the Catholic Church, Southern Baptists, and Conservative Mennonites all share?

One obvious one is a male-dominated hierarchy and lack of women in leadership roles.
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Josh

Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by Josh »

Valerie,

Part of the problem is that plain people really do portray themselves as “better” than the world. And they tend to think of themselves that way.

So when something like this happens, it’s more hurtful and shocking.
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Josh

Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by Josh »

Ken wrote:What common denominator do the Catholic Church, Southern Baptists, and Conservative Mennonites all share?

One obvious one is a male-dominated hierarchy and lack of women in leadership roles.
MC USA doesn’t meet that description yet they’ve had all the same kinds of problems too.

Putting women in power doesn’t end abuse. Women can also abuse, and can also cover up and protect abusers.
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temporal1

Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by temporal1 »

Ken wrote:
MaxPC wrote:Southern Baptists are also dealing with their own sex abuse scandal.
https://www.tennessean.com/story/news/r ... 405737001/

https://caringwell.com/wp-content/uploa ... e-2019.pdf

It seems to be an epidemic across denominations and cultures. What do you think is causing it?
What common denominator do the Catholic Church, Southern Baptists, and Conservative Mennonites all share?

One obvious one is a male-dominated hierarchy and lack of women in leadership roles.
Women play indispensible roles in each of these churches.
Default-to-female ministry is a superficial, even knee-jerk, response that would result in more problems than than it addresses.

i appreciate your input, welcome to the forum! :D
but, on this, i doubt we would agree.
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joshuabgood

Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by joshuabgood »

https://trudymetzger.files.wordpress.co ... nkster.pdf

As men under authority they were no longer free to follow their consciences but had to follow the directives of the board and their lawyers.

Wow...just wow. 1945
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blackfriar
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Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by blackfriar »

Ken wrote:
What common denominator do the Catholic Church, Southern Baptists, and Conservative Mennonites all share?
I think the common denominator is power. In any organization with hierarchical power structures you have an environment where abuse can happen -- and then when it's discovered emphasis is put on saving the organization and those in power vs dealing with the abuse that has happened.
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blackfriar
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Re: CAM Molestation Issue

Post by blackfriar »

joshuabgood wrote: As men under authority they were no longer free to follow their consciences but had to follow the directives of the board and their lawyers.
So discouraging, and at the same time, very revealing.
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