The Nicene Creed

[MaxPC]

I have a really great pamphlet about the various creeds the Church put together. To be honest, they were not about worship. The Nicene Creed was put together when over 300 bishops were called together to address the cancerous heresy Arius was spreading. It was not meant to be a lengthy teaching-, but fence around essentials that would make a foundation against heretical ideas. It was easy to memorize, and recite which Church's do weekly. Some recite the Apostles Creed instead. There doesn't seem to be a record of this Creeds origination

Indeed, that's the reason for the Nicene Creed's composition: to expand upon the Apostle's Creed; to reaffirm that Jesus is both God and man; and to articulate the nature of the Trinity. It was necessary because of the numerous erroneous theologies and heresies that had emerged. There were actually two Nicene Creeds, the original in 325 AD; the second was a modification adopted in 381 AD. You can probably read a lot more of the history online and I won't belabor the points here.

[temporal1]

Interesting to learn and wonder.
In the past, memorizing was respected and valued. It was necessary.

Even one generation back from me, memorization work was expected, in church and school.
Reciting scriptures, and, lengthy poetry, from memory, were popular pass times.

Then came ideas about purposely NOT memorizing, but, putting things “in your own words.”
That, with the emphasis of learning how to find sources, rather than memorizing.
Memory work was devalued.

This move so strongly against memory has a price.

Funny, how so often people take on experiments, while claiming them to be “truth.” or, settled science. Only later will that be determined. Often, too late to effectively correct.

[Ernie]

I think that creeds, confessions, and doctrinal statements should be viewed as a response to the challenges and accusations of a particular time period and to affirm certain universal Christian beliefs that seemed important at the time. They were not written as a an unabridged listing of Bible doctrines.

[temporal1]

I think that creeds, confessions, and doctrinal statements should be viewed as a response to the challenges and accusations of a particular time period and to affirm certain universal Christian beliefs that seemed important at the time.

They were not written as a an unabridged listing of Bible doctrines.

i think so. there was no intention of eliminating Bible doctrines; it was not, either/or, but support of Bible doctrines.

i’m still intrigued by how they happened to compose the wording, directly from scriptures.
i may have had a slight subliminal sense of it, but seeing it written out in so many words, piqued my interest.

[KingdomBuilder]

Cheers for the Catholic Church shoving the trinity doctrine down everyone's throat.

....Make that 3 cheers

Seriously though, these creeds elevate high-headed reasoning and make them as essential for salvation, all while they demean so much practicality of the Gospel.

[Valerie]

Cheers for the Catholic Church shoving the trinity doctrine down everyone's throat.

....Make that 3 cheers

Seriously though, these creeds elevate high-headed reasoning and make them as essential for salvation, all while they demean so much practicality of the Gospel.

It wasn't shoved down my throat at all, it is a beautiful truth, and is am awesome conveyance of something the natural man cannot begin to grasp, Holy Spirit ley, as Jesus taught to Baptize all nations in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit- the natural/carnal man can get that misconstrued, thus the various cults that arose in getting this confused. Of you weren't there during the heretical uprisings, its easy to misunderstand why they were necessary and keep on mind- Christians didn't own their own Bibles ( for that matter, the NT wasn't canonized by the Catholic Church yet, this the benefit of Creeds should be obvious

[Josh]

The Nicene vs Arian council was basically a political battle. Most Arian countries were the ones surrounding Ancient Rome, and Rome itself was anti-Arian.

The Arians were a lot better at sending out missionaries, so most newer people groups who were Christians were Arians.

The actual council involved threats of violence and the anti-Arians basically came better armed and with more troops backing them. So they won the council.

Jesus himself was certainly grieved to see men threatening to kill each other over opinions on matters like his pre-existence. Jesus didn’t tell us what christology to have or what doctrine of the Trinity to have. He did tell us to stop killing, doing violence, and to love our enemies. The 4th century ecumenical councils were the polar opposite of that.

I would take these creeds more seriously if they ever mentioned the Sermon on the Mount. Instead, these creeds pervert the gospel into a doctrine of man.

[Bootstrap]

They both make the same mistake, skipping over the life, example, and teachings of Christ as if they didn't exist - as if it didn't matter all that much:

• NICENE
  ...Who for us men and for our salvation
  came down from Heaven,
  and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary,
  and became man.
  [Where is the Life, Teachings and Example of Christ?]
  And was crucified for us...

Exactly. There's a punctuation mark where I expect to find most of what Jesus said and did, but the text is missing.

To me, these creeds do not fully capture the centrality of Christ in the Christian faith. The Jesus they present is too doctrinal and devotional for my Anabaptist sensibilities - the kind of Jesus one would make an icon out of rather than the kind one would seek to emulate.

I would much prefer statements of worship, as we find in the Bible, worshipping God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit for these things instead of stating them as dry theological assertions.

The greatest commandment is missing here too, to love God with all our heart and soul and mind and strength, and to love our neighbor as ourselves. There is nothing about trusting or obeying God and nothing about everyday repentance, grace, and forgiveness.

And I would much prefer a creed that calls us to discipleship, laying down ourselves, picking up our crosses, and following Jesus. The Creed commits us to nothing as long as we stand safely between the pews and say the right words.

[Valerie]

The inability to put onrself in the situation of what was happening at the time. Worship was not something being questioned at that time. So don't recite it, some do some don't, its not as if the Creed was relaxing any Scripture, it was to address a specific heresy. No one here- was there. It's easy to process to know what should or shouldn't have been done- most of the Bishops that arrived to the call of the council, had the marks of persecution on their bodies. The Church started council meetings to settle things adin Acts 15, and yes. It is important to understand who Jesus is in addition to what He taught. Well actually, He taughtbthT the Spirit reveals who He is. This is how we can identify cults. Plus Scripture itself instructs to address, not ignore-heredy, a work of the flesh.

[Josh]

I’m not sure why councils Constantine presided over (who was himself baptised by an Arian bishop) holds any validity at all concerning what is “heresy”.