New Songs, New Sermons, New Prayers, New Devotionals - Why?

[barnhart]

All of the old songs were once new songs. (Duh.) Many of those new songs didn't 'make it', and are seldom if ever sung anymore. As I mentioned in another discussion, I think that we DO need song writers in our own midst, those who can create well-written songs that represent our anabaptist understanding of Scripture, and that flow easily (without forced lyrics that compromise normal English intonation patterns). And, music that is created for the human voice, not just the fancy choral music that is often difficult for the non-trained voice, or that draws attention to the human vocal capabilities more than to the Biblical truths of the words.

I agree, especially on the first part. I might have more room than you for slightly challenging songs, it's motivating and engaging to learn new and different material even when it is slightly beyond the comfort level of the group. I have taken the time and effort to teach our church to sing 606 in the mennonite hymnal, which is quite challenging if you didn't grow up in a singing culture or are unfamiliar with it. We also learned Pepper's "We are not alone" and Nickel's "True evangelical faith" to certain extent but I gave up on that one a little.

(I also think that it's time to let the old 'sea-going themes' rest. The old songs that use these experiences are fine - I'm not saying that we need to avoid them. But the average person today does not have those experiences, and new points of contact with both culture and common experience can and should be utilized.)

I have marveled at that as well, whole churches of people who have never been on a ship singing about it as a metaphor. There are some gospel songs about trains, but it seems like that transportation technology didn't capture the imagination and jet travel even less. About 10 years ago maybe a little more, it seemed like every third song on Christian radio was about water events, oceans, rivers, floods, heavy rain... it seemed tedious to me and I wondered how people who take such music "seriously" didn't seem to notice.

There's a lot of 'foreign theology' being foisted on us by new songs that were written by people with either no depth of Spiritual truth, or who are representing belief systems that are not fitting for us as anabaptists.

I think this is true. Some areas of offense are Penal Substantial Atonement, neo Gnostic "fly away" gospel, neo Gnostic intellectual consent gospel, and hyper individual gospel.

[JohnH]

Most people would not relate very well to a song about jet travel being buffeted by poor weather to the point everyone on board feared for their lives, or train travel with a risk of... a tornado? Sudden derailment? The reality is we just don't take dangerous modes of transportation today...

... well, except for the car, which is ridiculously dangerous and pretty much most of the congregation will have arrived via that mode. Perhaps a good example of such a song is "Jesus, Take The Wheel":

She was driving last Friday on her way to Cincinnati on a snow-white Christmas Eve
Going home to see her mama and her daddy with the baby in the backseat
50 miles to go, and she was running low on faith and gasoline
It'd been a long, hard year

She had a lot on her mind, and she didn't pay attention
She was going way too fast
Before she knew it, she was spinning on a thin black sheet of glass
She saw both their lives flash before her eyes
She didn't even have time to cry
She was so scared
She threw her hands up in the air

Jesus, take the wheel
Take it from my hands
'Cause I can't do this on my own
I'm letting go
So give me one more chance
And save me from this road I'm on
Jesus, take the wheel

It was still getting colder when she made it to the shoulder
And the car came to a stop
She cried when she saw that baby in the backseat, sleeping like a rock
And for the first time in a long time
She bowed her head to pray
She said, "I'm sorry for the way I've been living my life
I know I've got to change, so from now on tonight"

Jesus, take the wheel
Take it from my hands
'Cause I can't do this on my own
I'm letting go
So give me one more chance
And save me from this road I'm on
Oh, Jesus, take the wheel

Oh, I'm letting go
So give me one more chance
Save me from this road I'm on
From this road I'm on

Jesus, take the wheel
Oh, take it, take it from me

Despite the inspiration I've derived from that song, I doubt I will be seeing any of our churches, or even perhaps a group like Oasis Tabernacle, performing it anytime soon.

Edit: this is the best acapalla chorus recording I could find... perhaps those who appreciate the performing arts and recordings of acapella music can do a better recording:

[Wesleyb]

In response to the original question, it seems to me true conservatives tend to freeze musical and preaching styles and language where it was just before they broke from their original group. True progressives see it as self-evident that these things need to change to keep up with the current culture so we need lots of new songs, rewording of old ones, up to date language in sermons, integration of new technology, etc. As with a lot of issues I find myself somewhere in between.

[barnhart]

It does seem strange the only two options should be always all new or never anything new but maybe those positions are more comfortable somehow. Ambiguity can be unsettling.

[Neto]

It does seem strange the only two options should be always all new or never anything new but maybe those positions are more comfortable somehow. Ambiguity can be unsettling.

In the MB congregation where I was until I moved to Ohio (at the age of 27) we had a range of old and new songs, a mix. The choir especially sang some newer songs, like Bill Gaither stuff, but also special arrangements of old hymns.

But now the trend (here) is the rather wild music, with a beat box, several guitars, and an electronic keyboard. Our congregation went straight from accapella to electronic piano, never had a real piano. So there was a wide range of 'special effects' possible from the beginning. Meanwhile, our sons have a good friend whose wife is a Presbyterian pastor, and THEY still sing almost exclusively hymns. Why do Mennonites need to be on the cutting edge?

[R7ehr]

In response to the original question, it seems to me true conservatives tend to freeze musical and preaching styles and language where it was just before they broke from their original group. True progressives see it as self-evident that these things need to change to keep up with the current culture so we need lots of new songs, rewording of old ones, up to date language in sermons, integration of new technology, etc. As with a lot of issues I find myself somewhere in between.

It does seem strange the only two options should be always all new or never anything new but maybe those positions are more comfortable somehow. Ambiguity can be unsettling.

Ambiguity feels rudderless, aimless, for conservatives and/or some personality types.

Speaking for myself, I can easier support “somewhere in between” the more I have confidence that it is thought out and intentional.

[JohnH]

In response to the original question, it seems to me true conservatives tend to freeze musical and preaching styles and language where it was just before they broke from their original group. True progressives see it as self-evident that these things need to change to keep up with the current culture so we need lots of new songs, rewording of old ones, up to date language in sermons, integration of new technology, etc. As with a lot of issues I find myself somewhere in between.

It does seem strange the only two options should be always all new or never anything new but maybe those positions are more comfortable somehow. Ambiguity can be unsettling.

Ambiguity feels rudderless, aimless, for conservatives and/or some personality types.

Speaking for myself, I can easier support “somewhere in between” the more I have confidence that it is thought out and intentional.

The reality is that a lot of Pentecostal, evangelical, Baptist, etc churches are not undergoing a transition where they seek to become more worldly.

A lot of Anabaptists are.

I would prefer to be at a, for example, BMA or Keystone church that is content to stay the same than to be in (for example) the “Brotherhood Amish” group that claims to be planning to stay Amish, but also is planning to acquire cars, trucks, smartphones, church houses, and so forth, and claims there is “revival breaking out”. There is an utter lack of insight inside Anabaptist circles that becoming closer to Christ generally doesn’t mean moving closer to the world’s way of doing things.

[R7ehr]

In response to the original question, it seems to me true conservatives tend to freeze musical and preaching styles and language where it was just before they broke from their original group. True progressives see it as self-evident that these things need to change to keep up with the current culture so we need lots of new songs, rewording of old ones, up to date language in sermons, integration of new technology, etc. As with a lot of issues I find myself somewhere in between.

It does seem strange the only two options should be always all new or never anything new but maybe those positions are more comfortable somehow. Ambiguity can be unsettling.

Ambiguity feels rudderless, aimless, for conservatives and/or some personality types.

Speaking for myself, I can easier support “somewhere in between” the more I have confidence that it is thought out and intentional.

The reality is that a lot of Pentecostal, evangelical, Baptist, etc churches are not undergoing a transition where they seek to become more worldly.

A lot of Anabaptists are.

I would prefer to be at a, for example, BMA or Keystone church that is content to stay the same than to be in (for example) the “Brotherhood Amish” group that claims to be planning to stay Amish, but also is planning to acquire cars, trucks, smartphones, church houses, and so forth, and claims there is “revival breaking out”. There is an utter lack of insight inside Anabaptist circles that becoming closer to Christ generally doesn’t mean moving closer to the world’s way of doing things.

I agree.

[Thomas_muntzer]

On the opposite end of the spectrum, we have the spectre of AI-generated sermons which are quite fast coming into vogue in evangelical circles, optimised for feeling fresh and engaging to audiences. One question I have faced is what does it mean, exactly, when AI tools can compose a better sermon than any human beings can, in terms of one that pleases audiences?

These are very good questions, especially since Jesus' message is valid for all times and places. With so many centuries during which millions of people have studied and written their thoughts, reflections, and research on the Holy Word, the real question is what more is there to say?

Regarding AI, it's something that, unfortunately, we're going to see more and more of. Something I've noticed a lot is the advertising done by AI on billboards and signs in the street. Personally, I don't like it at all, but seeing the sheer volume, many people think differently than I do.

[Thomas_muntzer]

I think this is true. Some areas of offense are Penal Substantial Atonement, neo Gnostic "fly away" gospel, neo Gnostic intellectual consent gospel, and hyper individual gospel.

What do you mean by neo Gnostic "fly away" gospel and neo Gnostic intellectual consent gospel ?