Performing Arts, Big Business, Pride, Worldliness

[MattY]

I think conflating performing arts with expensive houses, expensive cars, big businesses, etc., is comparing apples and oranges. Obviously performing artists might be highly successful rich people. But so might someone in many other occupations, such as carpenters, farmers, roofers, store owners, dealers in purple cloth, nomadic herders, and so on. You don't hear anyone warning against the risks of those occupations in a tone that suggests it's unwise to have such an occupation. And in Scripture, warnings are not against any occupation which might make one wealthy or prideful per se, but against the risks of wealth, the love of money, the danger of pride, etc.

Regarding performing arts and pride, the real comparison is to excellence in any other form of work. Should we encourage book writers to maybe put some misspelled words and bad grammar into their writing? Should they avoid writing gripping stories that engage people's hearts because others might not be as good at writing as they are? Should they avoid writing and selling books at all because they might have pride from good reviews or high sales? What about woodworking, such as finish carpenters - should they avoid doing excellent work that will be praised, because that risks pride? What about cabinet makers? A homeowner wants beautiful cabinets but I might be prideful because of how good a job I did, and besides, I am profiting from their wealth. And perhaps my work will be featured in a magazine or I might make beautiful cabinets in a display that many people will see and admire.

Pursuing excellence in any of these occupations is not fundamentally different than pursuing excellence in music as a classical musician or yes, even producing the best country or contemporary music that I can. Because if I do the best that I can, in whatever occupation I am in, that glorifies God. God is the one who created our abilities to be excellent in music, exceptional in arts, and generally excellent in whatever occupation we have - as part of the creation mandate to fill the earth and subdue it. We bear God's image and pursuing things like art, music, science, etc., is as worthy as any other occupation, because those things reflect God's truth. In fact, because all humans bear God's image, even music and art (and scientific insights, etc.) produced by non-Christians can be full of truth and beauty, and thus they glorify God unwittingly. All truth is God's truth. (I think that is what Josh was saying with some of those musicians he mentioned in his post - not that the end justifies the means, but that the image of God is in all of them, and God's purpose and glory is much broader than our little section of Christianity).

[R7ehr]

Among other things mentioned, Christianity has long held entertainment in lower regard than other occupations that are more fundamental to meeting the needs of mankind. And this low regard for entertainment is still found overflowing from Plain Anabaptism onto the performing arts.

[Ernie]

I think conflating performing arts with expensive houses, expensive cars, big businesses, etc., is comparing apples and oranges. Obviously performing artists might be highly successful rich people. But so might someone in many other occupations, such as carpenters, farmers, roofers, store owners, dealers in purple cloth, nomadic herders, and so on. You don't hear anyone warning against the risks of those occupations in a tone that suggests it's unwise to have such an occupation. And in Scripture, warnings are not against any occupation which might make one wealthy or prideful per se, but against the risks of wealth, the love of money, the danger of pride, etc.

Regarding performing arts and pride, the real comparison is to excellence in any other form of work. Should we encourage book writers to maybe put some misspelled words and bad grammar into their writing? Should they avoid writing gripping stories that engage people's hearts because others might not be as good at writing as they are? Should they avoid writing and selling books at all because they might have pride from good reviews or high sales? What about woodworking, such as finish carpenters - should they avoid doing excellent work that will be praised, because that risks pride? What about cabinet makers? A homeowner wants beautiful cabinets but I might be prideful because of how good a job I did, and besides, I am profiting from their wealth. And perhaps my work will be featured in a magazine or I might make beautiful cabinets in a display that many people will see and admire.

Pursuing excellence in any of these occupations is not fundamentally different than pursuing excellence in music as a classical musician or yes, even producing the best country or contemporary music that I can. Because if I do the best that I can, in whatever occupation I am in, that glorifies God. God is the one who created our abilities to be excellent in music, exceptional in arts, and generally excellent in whatever occupation we have - as part of the creation mandate to fill the earth and subdue it. We bear God's image and pursuing things like art, music, science, etc., is as worthy as any other occupation, because those things reflect God's truth. In fact, because all humans bear God's image, even music and art (and scientific insights, etc.) produced by non-Christians can be full of truth and beauty, and thus they glorify God unwittingly. All truth is God's truth. (I think that is what Josh was saying with some of those musicians he mentioned in his post - not that the end justifies the means, but that the image of God is in all of them, and God's purpose and glory is much broader than our little section of Christianity).

I see a big difference between doing something excellently vs. doing something for show. I don't think the two are equatable. And neither do most Plain Anabaptists.

[Ernie]

So a couple quick thoughts. First, as I alluded to earlier, I'm not sure what the perceived failure rates of those who pursue a creative career means.

I see a big difference between pursuing a creative career, and pursuing a career "to be seen of men".

There is a possibility that they haven't failed at all, only their actions are perceived as failure within a certain cultural context without violating anything biblically.

I see that as a strong possibility, if we are simply talking about pursuing a creative career.

But it's also quite likely that they have indeed failed, only their pursuit of an artistic career forced them to be at odds with their community, and as their community fragmented, other things went wrong in their lives.

Not sure if I understand what you are referring to when you say, "their community fragmented". Can you say more?

In another thread I outlined how I think a person could pursue an artistic career that would not force them to be at odds with their community.

Second, I wonder about how pride is understood. Sure, a talented virtuoso on stage can swell with pride at his/her own talent. But so can literally anyone, including a faithful conservative church goer who feels superior because of his personal habits. When performing arts are seen as somehow inherently promoting pride, I wonder if we are misunderstanding pride. Why focus on the potential pride that can come from the arts specifically?

Sure. Pride can be found in any human heart.
But again, the question in my mind is whether performing to be seen of men (providing entertainment as a career) is the sort of thing Jesus had in mind when he says, "Occupy until I come".

We interacted with a college football player for a number of years who attended our Bible studies.(because his girl friend did) He referred to his role as his "work". He is currently trying to get in with NFL. He believes in excellence as well. I'm curious if you see this as an acceptable career for a Christian as well.

The only reason to be focusing the conversation on the arts right now is because that seems to be something that a percentage of Plain Anabaptists are engaging in.
There are lots of other careers we could discuss as well, but they are not currently being pursued by Plain Anabaptists. So such conversations will not get much traction.

[Ernie]

When performing arts are seen as somehow inherently promoting pride, I wonder if we are misunderstanding pride. Why focus on the potential pride that can come from the arts specifically?

At Faith Builders Training Institute, students are taught how to properly bow and curtsy after performing a solo.

At classical concerts, laudations at the beginning and many minutes of applause at the end are very normal things. (accompanied by bowing and curtsying)

Might I be correct to assume that you are fine with such things?

Does the Bible have anything to say about these things?

What if a preacher gave a really fine sermon. Would it be fine to give him the same sort of laudations at the beginning and many minutes of applause at the end? If not, why not?

[Ernie]

There is a possibility that they haven't failed at all, only their actions are perceived as failure within a certain cultural context without violating anything biblically.

Some folks have observed that the Reformers assumed that anything not forbidden in the Bible was fair game for the Christian. In contrast the early Anabaptists who shared a common faith were more interested in pursuing what the New Testament promoted as the ideal.

I don't know for sure where you come out on this... I don't want to read too much into your comment... But I think this distinction I mentioned does make a big difference in how we order our lives, what choices we make, what things we pursue, what things we eschew, etc.

[Ernie]

No actually, I think it would be interesting to discuss music specifically and why there are aversions to pursuing it for purported reasons of avoiding pride and promoting simplicity. Obviously there's a lot to be said about materialism itself, but even in the most conservative contexts, spending large amounts of money can escape under the radar even as the arts are discouraged. I've never followed the logic.

As I indicated earlier, the inconsistency is noticed by many. If it wasn't for scores of thousands of Plain Anabaptists who notice the inconsistency and speak out against it, I don't think there would even be such a thing as a Plain Anabaptist movement, or at least not a movement of any size.

I realize that many people aren't all that concerned about plainness and simplicity and radically following Jesus, even within Plain Anabaptism.

And there are those who don't really care whether there is a Plain Anabaptist movement or not. If so, there is non-Plain Anabaptist movement they can be part of that doesn't have any criticism of or warnings against performing arts, big business, major league sports, luxurious church buildings, etc.

[Ernie]

Articles have been written about the nature of our work and what it does to us as a person.

Making and selling the most gorgeous kitchen cabinets made of the finest woods available might be "excellence". (That can only be purchased by a few of the most well-to-do.) And it might provide employment for quite a number of households. And the excess income that is generated from such sales might be able to fund a lot of missions.
But what does it do to or do for the people who are involved in the work?

Many have discovered part way through life or at the end of life that the work itself produced an emptiness or a void. They question at some point whether this is really what God intended for human existence on this planet and whether this is really what humans were created for.

In contrast, is the person whose livelihood is meeting a real human need or is contributing to human flourishing. Such folks are more likely to find real value and meaning in their work and feel like their work (not just the proceeds from their work) is a part of God's big plan.

[barnhart]

Of the types of pride Jesus addressed, I'm not aware the pride of artists in their craft was ever mentioned. The type he condemned was the pride of religious people in their practice. At minimum this means the pride of religious people in their practice is a true danger.

I have room for groups who make judgements about the dangers of things like the arts and exercise care around them but it looks hard to maintain broad bans without falling into inconsistency. And inconsistency often breeds contempt and rejection.

I imagine old order groups like the Amish had similar discussions about the introduction of singing harmony or singing in English and decided it would lead to pride and worldliness and by their definitions, maybe it does.

[joshuabgood]

Probably no surprise but I agree with Seeking-Artist. Big business, big houses, big cabins, big vehicles don't seem to be problematic, in fact, they are often seen as evidence of God's blessing. And indeed perhaps they are. From my point of view, so is art. Conrad Fisher's music, blues scales, folk music, the afore mentioned tin pan alley, jazz, bluegrass, southern, southern gospel, Baroque, opera, musical theater...everyone from Oasis, Gershwin to Billy Strings to Bono, to R Stanley, to Steve Green, to Phil Keaggy to Forest Frank, to Pavarotti, to Johnny Cash, to Bob Marley, to the Edwin Hawkins singers, to Lyrica Sacra, to Lauren Daigle, to Harmonia Sacra, to congregational singing, to singing in old people's homes (and all the ones in between) have been "God's blessing" for me on occasion.

The more art the more I am able to live a full and enriched life.

I don't doubt your perception but I for one don't believe that the end justifies the means.

I generally agree "the ends don't justify the means," though for the record I don't think that works as a moral axiom. For instance cutting a person's body open is justified when the purpose is to remove cancer...however, if the purpose is to inflict pain and suffering, it is not. (Also for the record I wasn't "converted" at a rock concert. I was raised on the Church Hymnal and the Christian Hymnal and still love those songs and singing them anywhere with anybody.)

The main difference though I have, is that it seems to me your statement begs the question. It seems to assume that the means in question are something "negative." But that is the question. Are the means (artistic human expression) negative? I don't think so. I think art for its own sake is good. The fact that it serves no "utilitarian" purpose is its beauty. It's only function is to draw us to an enriched human experience and point us toward the divine. People's capacity to innovate and produce art, is a reflection of God's divine image in us.