An Increasing Number of Children Estranged from Parents

[JohnH]

An Increasing Number of Children Estranged from Parents in the West

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... s-beckhams

https://knowablemagazine.org/content/ar ... trangement

https://theweek.com/culture-life/no-con ... trangement

Might this be a Gospel opportunity for Conservative Anabaptists with good homes? I'm thinking of coming along side these folks and helping them work through their issues.

This is my opinion, and it’s not going to be popular in this forum…but here goes:

I think before conservative Anabaptists try to reach out to estranged children, they should first require repentance and humility from the abusive parents in their own culture who have estranged children.

If my kids ever come to me and tell me that I hurt them in ways that have made it hard for my kids to be in my presence, I hope and I pray that I will, in humility, repent.

Just because my intentions were good does not mean my actions were not harmful. As a parent, I’m still growing too. I’m still learning. Humility on my part is needed.

Humility would a long way in these cases of parent/child estrangement.

The topic at hand is situations that generally do not rise to the level of “abuse”. The Bible does teach us to honour and respect our parents and also to care for them in their old age.

[ohio jones]

Reminder:

Don't try to define the content of someone else's thread with statements like "what we are talking about is..."

[temporal1]

A new article from WSJ.
https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/relations ... _permalink

This article says that therapists are now more inclined to recommend clients cut off contact with parents vs. try to help them resolve issues with parents. Some takers who fell for this now have regrets.

After decades of urging families to communicate better and work on their issues together, some therapists are now taking an opposite tack: They’re encouraging estrangement as a means of self-care...

Most therapists agree that sometimes people are justified in breaking ties with their parents or a close relative, especially if they were physically or emotionally abusive.

What’s changing now is the bar for what is deemed abusive enough for a cutoff. “We are in a culture where we emphasize fragility, everything becomes trauma, and the solution increasingly is to split and leave,” says William Doherty...
“But it should be the tragic exception that you cut off a parent or loved one, not business as usual in therapy.”

May 31 / OP:
An Increasing Number of Children Estranged from Parents in the West

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... s-beckhams

https://knowablemagazine.org/content/ar ... trangement

https://theweek.com/culture-life/no-con ... trangement

Might this be a Gospel opportunity for Conservative Anabaptists with good homes? I'm thinking of coming along side these folks and helping them work through their issues.

This is my opinion, and it’s not going to be popular in this forum…but here goes:

I think before conservative Anabaptists try to reach out to estranged children, they should first require repentance and humility from the abusive parents in their own culture who have estranged children.

If my kids ever come to me and tell me that I hurt them in ways that have made it hard for my kids to be in my presence, I hope and I pray that I will, in humility, repent.

Just because my intentions were good does not mean my actions were not harmful. As a parent, I’m still growing too. I’m still learning. Humility on my part is needed.

Humility would a long way in these cases of parent/child estrangement.

anndet92:
i’m wondering if you would consider creating a POLL topic on the points for which you’re expressing and seeking answers?
(i believe) POLLS can include 10 questions or points.

It’s summer, this forum tends to be less active in summers, i.e., fewer members actively posting,
PLUS, all year there are lots of read-only folks, members and not. It seems some who don’t actively participate in discussions will anonymously respond to POLL questions. Response requires being registered.

(i think) it’s ok to request members to share which POLL points they chose and why.

(i believe) you might have general if not unanimous agreement on many points.
POLLS are an imperfect incomplete tool to add to the mix.

It’s important to identfy problems as clearly as possible, and to avoid “painting with too broad a brush”.

In recent months there’s been great hoopla in public and on forum about Somalians.
The bottom line is to identify (abusers of the public trust and treasury) - - without harming those innocent of these crimes.

(In my case) i’d like to see serious focus on the complicit elected, the enablers at the top, without whom, the abusers on the ground would not have gotten anywhere, let alone unbridled access to big fortunes in the Public Treasury.

A POLL might be a helpful means to descibe your particular goals, and get informal forum response to those goals.

praying for [__] good outcomes from this.
God provides His way for all those seeking.

often, the most difficult situations open unexpected doors.

No rush.
These problems (sins+crimes) have been going on since The Garden, there’s no quick fix, evil makes sure of that.
For both prevention and mitigation of damages. Evil remains stubbornly unchanged over time.

[temporal1]

A new article from WSJ.
https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/relations ... _permalink

This article says that therapists are now more inclined to recommend clients cut off contact with parents vs. try to help them resolve issues with parents. Some takers who fell for this now have regrets.

After decades of urging families to communicate better and work on their issues together, some therapists are now taking an opposite tack: They’re encouraging estrangement as a means of self-care...

Most therapists agree that sometimes people are justified in breaking ties with their parents or a close relative, especially if they were physically or emotionally abusive.

What’s changing now is the bar for what is deemed abusive enough for a cutoff. “We are in a culture where we emphasize fragility, everything becomes trauma, and the solution increasingly is to split and leave,” says William Doherty...
“But it should be the tragic exception that you cut off a parent or loved one, not business as usual in therapy.”

This means a lot to me.
Psychiatry is NOT settled science, i’ve learned over decades of my life.
i urge anyone seeking help to be both alert and patient, understanding, in distress, neither is easy, maybe not possible.

i groan remembering the 60-70’s, when the world was set “free+new” - esp wrt cheap-free birth constrol pills, abortions, normalized fornication and DIVORCE, etc. All promoted in airwaves, public schools, K-college, etc. Many “understood”, if counseling was sought, divorce would result. Ghastly, really. i believe counseling has generally stepped back from that ledge over time.

It’s sad to realize, vulnerable people may or may not get constructive advice from professionals.
That’s reality. There is no slam dunk answer for most problems. No matter how we wish it.

Be cautious of “waves” of attractive popular thinking, esp that rashly defies ancient wisdom.
There’s usually a price, sometimes a heavy price with lasting harm.

Without deliberating, i experienced a well-meaning psychologist, i didn’t know, and neither did he. Everything kept getting worse, we both agreed. Fortunately, i eventually landed in the hands of a (genius) psychiatrist, with remarkable results/improvement. i wish he were still available today. God bless him, where ever he is.

psychiatry is touchy and personal “business”. no guarantees. science isn’t there yet. maybe one day.
i learned more from neurologists when my husband received a terminal illness.
very well educated multi-degreed doctors openly describe their work as “in its infancy”. i respect their candor and humility.

In all matters, at all times, pray for protection and guidance from the Holy Spirit.
The one who does not lie.

[JohnH]

i groan remembering the 60-70’s, when the world was set “free+new” - esp wrt cheap-free birth constrol pills, abortions, normalized fornication and DIVORCE, etc. All promoted in airwaves, public schools, K-college, etc. Many “understood”, if counseling was sought, divorce would result. Ghastly, really. i believe counseling has generally stepped back from that ledge over time.

In the 60s/70s, the forefront of psychiatry was making claims that childhood sexual abuse isn't a big deal, and it's best if it's just ignored/swept under the rug as it wouldn't affect young children if they couldn't remember it. This extended as far as to professional advice given to the Catholic church that they should just try to downplay/ignore clergy who were chronic abusers.

Makes me really question the "professionals".

[temporal1]

i groan remembering the 60-70’s, when the world was set “free+new” - esp wrt cheap-free birth constrol pills, abortions, normalized fornication and DIVORCE, etc. All promoted in airwaves, public schools, K-college, etc. Many “understood”, if counseling was sought, divorce would result. Ghastly, really. i believe counseling has generally stepped back from that ledge over time.

In the 60s/70s, the forefront of psychiatry was making claims that childhood sexual abuse isn't a big deal, and it's best if it's just ignored/swept under the rug as it wouldn't affect young children if they couldn't remember it. This extended as far as to professional advice given to the Catholic church that they should just try to downplay/ignore clergy who were chronic abusers.

Makes me really question the "professionals".

i don’t recall this in my personal experience, BUT, decades later, i read about The Kinsey Report, 1953, and other horrors that i believe directly impacted (esp academia) - the worst of the worst. i know nothing of what influenced the Catholic Church - but -
i’m pretty sure CSA by C priests was one of Martin Luther’s complaints, which i found so hard to imagine. Hundreds of years ago.

When i say these sins+crimes go back to The Garden, i’m thinking literally.
When i say evil exists unchanged over time, i’m thinking literally. As stunning as it is to imagine.

After the major priest sex abuse scandals revealed n the 90’s, i couldn’t help but notice exact patterns of denying+covering up these sins, NO MATTER SITUATION. Churches, families, clubs, gov entities, they all use identical methods to 1) escape responsibility, and to 2) continue in sin.

The Catholic Church scandal was at scale.
As an ignorant outsider, i couldn’t imagine how they could continue.

A lot unfolded, directly and indirectly, 3 popes in that time. Changes have been made.
The RCC continues. i hope without CSA.

Wrt to professionals.
i value them, BUT no longer trust in ignorance.
Unfortunately, care should be taken to try to make sure you’re getting a pro that is experienced+successful in the problem at hand. Typically, help is sought when a person is not prepared to be figuring out which doctor/counselor is best!

The best that can be done is recognize the pros are human and fallible. The science is not complete.
Pray for protection+guidance from the Holy Spirit.

Don’t expect perfection. Don’t ignore red flags.

[Bootstrap]

This is my opinion, and it’s not going to be popular in this forum…but here goes:

I think before conservative Anabaptists try to reach out to estranged children, they should first require repentance and humility from the abusive parents in their own culture who have estranged children.

If my kids ever come to me and tell me that I hurt them in ways that have made it hard for my kids to be in my presence, I hope and I pray that I will, in humility, repent.

Just because my intentions were good does not mean my actions were not harmful. As a parent, I’m still growing too. I’m still learning. Humility on my part is needed.

Humility would a long way in these cases of parent/child estrangement.

Anndet, I appreciate your posts, you raise important points that we can gloss over.

I have an estranged daughter, and part of the problem I have is that so may of the things she says she was injured by involve not affirming her trans identity. She does not want me to have pictures of her as a child, because they clearly look female. She wants me to positively affirm that there are more than two genders. And I frankly don't know how to apologize for these things with integrity. She sees it as abusive to not do these things. So we are stuck.

Like any parent, I have done some things that I do see as harmful. But those are not the things she wants to talk about. There's a set of preconditions to have any conversation. And I just don't know how to give her what she is asking for.

[Valerie]

This is my opinion, and it’s not going to be popular in this forum…but here goes:

I think before conservative Anabaptists try to reach out to estranged children, they should first require repentance and humility from the abusive parents in their own culture who have estranged children.

If my kids ever come to me and tell me that I hurt them in ways that have made it hard for my kids to be in my presence, I hope and I pray that I will, in humility, repent.

Just because my intentions were good does not mean my actions were not harmful. As a parent, I’m still growing too. I’m still learning. Humility on my part is needed.

Humility would a long way in these cases of parent/child estrangement.

Anndet, I appreciate your posts, you raise important points that we can gloss over.

I have an estranged daughter, and part of the problem I have is that so may of the things she says she was injured by involve not affirming her trans identity. She does not want me to have pictures of her as a child, because they clearly look female. She wants me to positively affirm that there are more than two genders. And I frankly don't know how to apologize for these things with integrity. She sees it as abusive to not do these things. So we are stuck.

Like any parent, I have done some things that I do see as harmful. But those are not the things she wants to talk about. There's a set of preconditions to have any conversation. And I just don't know how to give her what she is asking for.

Bootstrap, my heart goes out to you, so far you seem guided by Holy Spirit and Gods Word to help you keep from compromising and giving in to what you know to be false, but I’m sure you can only be stuck. I believe that in the beginning when we were dealing with most of our country being totally against homosexuality and transgender because of family relationships and situations like your own gradually compassion, got in the way of standing for truth and so now we are here where it seems most of the country has catered to LGBTQ because so many have family relationships, especially sons and daughters caught up in this.

I shared somewhere on forum awhile ago my daughter cut me off in January. She called in birthday & Mothers Day but wants no relationship (unless i change political views, even though we NEVER talked politics!) The way this same across I felt it wasn’t “her” idea to cut me off. Apparently she’s dealing with anger & rage at others, & just made her husband leave & 12 year old daughter suffers from turmoil & is acting out her poisoned emotions.

There was a psychotherapist on FOX News who stated there are a lot of therapists in our country telling their clients to cut off family members who voted for Trump (i think the goal of that is to gain more people in hopes to impeach)

I cannot believe this happened to me and obviously my daughter is miserable so it is not “the answer”. May God help, steer, guide, counsel, heal-
I’ve never witnessed an epidemic like this one!!

[temporal1]

This is my opinion, and it’s not going to be popular in this forum…but here goes:

I think before conservative Anabaptists try to reach out to estranged children, they should first require repentance and humility from the abusive parents in their own culture who have estranged children.

If my kids ever come to me and tell me that I hurt them in ways that have made it hard for my kids to be in my presence, I hope and I pray that I will, in humility, repent.

Just because my intentions were good does not mean my actions were not harmful. As a parent, I’m still growing too. I’m still learning. Humility on my part is needed.

Humility would a long way in these cases of parent/child estrangement.

Anndet, I appreciate your posts, you raise important points that we can gloss over.

I have an estranged daughter, and part of the problem I have is that so may of the things she says she was injured by involve not affirming her trans identity. She does not want me to have pictures of her as a child, because they clearly look female. She wants me to positively affirm that there are more than two genders. And I frankly don't know how to apologize for these things with integrity. She sees it as abusive to not do these things. So we are stuck.

Like any parent, I have done some things that I do see as harmful. But those are not the things she wants to talk about. There's a set of preconditions to have any conversation. And I just don't know how to give her what she is asking for.

Bootstrap, my heart goes out to you, so far you seem guided by Holy Spirit and Gods Word to help you keep from compromising and giving in to what you know to be false, but I’m sure you can only be stuck. I believe that in the beginning when we were dealing with most of our country being totally against homosexuality and transgender because of family relationships and situations like your own gradually compassion, got in the way of standing for truth and so now we are here where it seems most of the country has catered to LGBTQ because so many have family relationships, especially sons and daughters caught up in this.

I shared somewhere on forum awhile ago my daughter cut me off in January. She called in birthday & Mothers Day but wants no relationship (unless i change political views, even though we NEVER talked politics!) The way this same across I felt it wasn’t “her” idea to cut me off. Apparently she’s dealing with anger & rage at others, & just made her husband leave & 12 year old daughter suffers from turmoil & is acting out her poisoned emotions.

There was a psychotherapist on FOX News who stated there are a lot of therapists in our country telling their clients to cut off family members who voted for Trump (i think the goal of that is to gain more people in hopes to impeach)

I cannot believe this happened to me and obviously my daughter is miserable so it is not “the answer”. May God help, steer, guide, counsel, heal-
I’ve never witnessed an epidemic like this one!!

i also have a precarious and painful situation i’m not sure i’m willing to describe.
doors have not been closed, but the threat of it hangs in the air. the problems affect everyone in reach.
it’s a sort of psychological extortion. at least, master manipulation.

altho i want to run, for the sake of all, i remain, hoping for improvement.
it’s not about politics or CSA or related.

it’s about psychological and verbal battering and abuse. for what purpose, i don’t know.
sometimes i think about physical abusers who are careful to hit only where physical bruises don’t show.

to me that’s what psych abusers do. they hit hard without leaving undeniable physical evidence.
it’s painful to experience and witness. esp when it’s someone close you care for and want the best for.

human law is well-intended but can be twisted to protect abusers, often in the name of privacy.
privacy laws “protect” abusers from getting much needed help.

so many ways to fail.

[temporal1]

This has been quoted now+then on forum.
i believe it’s from the ancients, sometimes attributed to modern sources.

i have met some privileged wealthy people battling with the most difficult hells.
One was a family who cared for then had to bury their beloved 4 year old daughter with leukemia.
No price tag on that.