July 4 2026 / 250 years

[temporal1]

i appreciate oj’s reminder.
the intent of the topic is to attempt to find positives about 250 years, History, no matter how strained they might be.

if no positives exist, move along. let the topic die a natural death. as many do.

[Bootstrap]

the intent of the topic is to attempt to find positives about 250 years, History, no matter how strained they might be.

I think my posts have been doing that. And I don't think the positives have been strained. Let me try to continue this thread:

But most importantly, I am a Christian, my faith is not in "American Greatness" or anything like that. This is how I think Christians should regard this country:

Dear friends, I urge you, as foreigners and exiles, to abstain from sinful desires, which wage war against your soul. Live such good lives among the pagans that, though they accuse you of doing wrong, they may see your good deeds and glorify God on the day he visits us.

Submit yourselves for the Lord’s sake to every human authority: whether to the emperor, as the supreme authority, or to governors, who are sent by him to punish those who do wrong and to commend those who do right. For it is God’s will that by doing good you should silence the ignorant talk of foolish people. Live as free people, but do not use your freedom as a cover-up for evil; live as God’s slaves. Show proper respect to everyone, love the family of believers, fear God, honor the emperor.

At the same time, I clearly am an American. And I believe in the principles found in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution. If we really believe in those principles, we need to keep our eyes open, because they are always under threat.

This is a country where so many people have fled religious persecution to find safety and religious freedom. And a lot of that involves the Constitution, the First Amendment, limits on what the government is allowed to do.

Some of this took a long time to work out. I would never serve in the military because of my religious beliefs, like many who came before me. But it wasn't until after World War II that Conscientious Objector status was a real thing, largely in response to some horror stories involving Anabaptists who refused to serve during World War II. And even after that, it's very hard to get Conscientious Objector status even if you have really good documentation of your beliefs.

So that's not perfect, but it's a lot better than what you see in a whole lot of other countries. Making room for religious minorities that do not buy into the dictates of politicized civil religion is always a challenge, because the way we think is not the way the politicians think. And our loyalties are different.

[ken_sylvania]

This is a country where so many people have fled religious persecution to find safety and religious freedom. And a lot of that involves the Constitution, the First Amendment, limits on what the government is allowed to do.

I don't know how much proof there is for that claim. America was a popular destination for individuals fleeing religious persecution well before 1787.

[mike]

This is a country where so many people have fled religious persecution to find safety and religious freedom. And a lot of that involves the Constitution, the First Amendment, limits on what the government is allowed to do.

I don't know how much proof there is for that claim. America was a popular destination for individuals fleeing religious persecution well before 1787.

William Penn - 1644 – 1718

[ken_sylvania]

This is a country where so many people have fled religious persecution to find safety and religious freedom. And a lot of that involves the Constitution, the First Amendment, limits on what the government is allowed to do.

I don't know how much proof there is for that claim. America was a popular destination for individuals fleeing religious persecution well before 1787.

William Penn - 1644 – 1718

My ancestors were very thankful that there was a Constitution and a First Amendment to limit what Penn was allowed to do...