Watercolor painting and artistic expression

[joshuabgood]

Wife: that looks like where’s Waldo or one of those style of art . I’ve never been fond of picassos stuff other than maybe starry night style. Other than mentioning da Vinci in history class, I don’t know that the school goes that much into art history. It’s not like I went through the school myself


Pilgrim and Western Fellowship don’t seem to have any issues with painting ect. I remember a seeker who made some beautiful watercolor paintings back out west that he gave People. Also, some of my friends doing watercolor.

Here, a lot of of the girls are really into pretty calligraphy mottos with colorful art around it, or those one adult coloring books. There’s also a few people I know that do portrait drawing, and the schools have used all sorts of mediums during art classes. My personal favorite was when they were doing woodburning, and also hoping my girls get in on a cake decorating class.

Also, furniture/cabinetry art is kind of cool and I’ve also known some people who repaint old furniture.

Starry Night...one of my favorites is Van Gogh fwiw...

[Soloist]

Wife: that looks like where’s Waldo or one of those style of art . I’ve never been fond of picassos stuff other than maybe starry night style. Other than mentioning da Vinci in history class, I don’t know that the school goes that much into art history. It’s not like I went through the school myself


Pilgrim and Western Fellowship don’t seem to have any issues with painting ect. I remember a seeker who made some beautiful watercolor paintings back out west that he gave People. Also, some of my friends doing watercolor.

Here, a lot of of the girls are really into pretty calligraphy mottos with colorful art around it, or those one adult coloring books. There’s also a few people I know that do portrait drawing, and the schools have used all sorts of mediums during art classes. My personal favorite was when they were doing woodburning, and also hoping my girls get in on a cake decorating class.

Also, furniture/cabinetry art is kind of cool and I’ve also known some people who repaint old furniture.

Starry Night...one of my favorites is Van Gogh fwiw...

Wife: I am such a dweeb. Probably slept through that part of art class. I always hated art history. Enjoyed drawing though, but didn’t ever wanna do people drawing classes in college because it was just getting perverted. How to draw faces is a really good art book that is clean. I would have to look it up to figure out the author, but she does crime portraits.

[Szdfan]

It is interesting to watch Anabaptists, particularly since just like hefalumps and Wolzells they come in every shape and size, discuss the arts. Of course, everyone is entitled to a pov, but while I can understand saying Picasso is ugly, calling it not true seems simply to prove the point you missed the point.

His Guernica is not to be viewed as pretty,. Like all art it expresses something. And you may dislike his techniques or style, but you cannot deny it expresses. And expresses something both important and expresses it in a moving and accurate way.

Many Anabaptists simply have their hands tied on issues like this.

And what is Picasso expressing in Guernica?

In Guernica, Picasso is expressing outrage and horror about war. He’s depicting the 1937 aerial bombardment and destruction of a Basque village by fascist forces during the Spanish Civil War. Originally intended for the Spanish pavilion at the World’s Fair, the painting is an expression of horror and outrage over civilian death and suffering by mechanized forces.

The painting isn’t conventionally “beautiful” because war isn’t beautiful. To depict the slaughter of civilians in an aesthetically pleasing or harmonious way is to lie and distort about the nature of war.

Guernica is the opposite of nihilistic “anti-anti art.” It is a deeply moral piece of work, condemning fascism, warfare and human suffering. After the World’s Fair, the painting toured the US to raise awareness about the Spanish Civil War and raise funds to support refugees.

Picasso refused to allow the painting to return to Spain until fascism ended and it wasn’t displayed in Spain until 1981, six years after Franco’s death.

I believe art shouldn’t just be judged over whether it’s aesthetically beautiful, but also whether it’s telling the truth about its subject.

Also, Guernica isn’t a postmodern piece of work. It’s an example of modernism, which rose out of the aftermath of World War I. It’s neither anti-human nor just self-indulgence. It’s an expression of the philosophical and artistic turmoil in the aftermath of some of the most devastating warfare in history. Modernism questioned the old concepts of artistic forms because they no longer made sense in a world with trench warfare, mustard gas, tanks and machine guns.

All of these interwar modernist genres — Dadaism, Surrealism, German Expressionism, etc. — are an expression of the interior turmoil and psychology in a world torn apart by war and growing political extremism. It’s a cry in the midst of civilizational turmoil. That’s also art that’s deeply human.

“Ugly” art can express truth, while aesthetically pleasing art can also lie.

[Ernie]

Ernie, as for the Shenandoah folks you mentioned, I am old enough (at 50 basically), and you probably as well, where music endeavors like that were really frowned on in the CA circles. And still are in the more ultra settings...I think. The concern/charge for decades was elitism combined with arguments that "good music" distracts from the message.

I'm friends with a number of the Shenandoah instructors and have spent hours with them discussing their observations about arts and Plain Anabaptists. They tell me that despite teaching (like what Julian is doing for the Hutterites), many musicians exit the Plain Anabaptist world because they think don't fit. Shenandoah music camp does give people a taste for something that they are not going to find in the rest of the Plain Anabaptist world.
The ones who stay don't necessarily feel like they fit either, but they are willing to put up with the "rejection" and the incongruities, because they see value in many of the other aspects of the culture.

I think this is true. It's hard to have an interest that is good in character but not shared or maybe looked at a bit questioningly by your community.

I heard (second-hand) from someone on the board at Shenandoah Music Camp that they consider the elitism there a real problem, to the point of discussing just shutting the whole thing down.

Yes, there is a conservative wing of Anabaptism that does not have any interest in something like Shenandoah Music Camp.

But as I have mentioned oft before, Old Orders and Ultra-Conservatives are dependent on intermediate-conservatives, moderate-conservatives, and progressive-conservatives. And vice-versa.

There is so much red tape and cautions and regulations in Old Order and Ultra-Conservative culture that it is hard for them to get some endeavors off the ground. It's easier to just give money or serve in other missions (at least for a decade or two) until they can get their own thing going. When they need counselors or attorneys or CPA's or online services, they look to the moderate-conservatives and progressive-conservatives to help them out.

Moderate-conservatives and progressive-conservatives parents typically have a hard time getting the next generation to value what they value or want to go to church with them. Consequently, they rely on an influx of people from more conservative churches to keep their attendance records stable and half of their leaders and teachers and influential people in the church generally come from more conservative groups. There is nothing like the "good stock" that comes from Christian communities that promote discipline, yieldedness, structure, sacrifice, endurance, humility, etc.
Too many moderate-conservatives and progressive-conservatives are abandoning these things. So much so that most groups would implode without a constant influx from more conservative churches.

As it relates to this topic, a few ultra-conservatives have been working on producing a hymnbook now for about 20 years. They want to include new hymns. But their people have a very difficult time composing music that sounds really good. So they have been relying on one of the most educated Shenandoah Music instructors to improve their songs in preparation for publishing in their hymnbook. He is a humble man and is willing to help them out, but this means transferring files by mail instead of online.
So even though the conservatives frown on higher ed, they rely on the folks with higher ed to help them have a good songbook.

[barnhart]

Some might say Picasso impressively captures the fragmented society that modernity brought. In a sort of jarring way, the art illustrates the break down of community, beauty, and civility. And captures the impact of tech on the world. And in that sense, while he is a modern artist, it hints at post-modernity.

I respect some of his work from a philosophical perspective much more than an aesthetic perspective. For example his refusal to submit to a fixed point of visual reference contradicts the western art tradition since the middle ages and produces a lot distortion. But is that is an insightful and accurate portrayal of a society or culture that has rejected fixed values.

Nonetheless I wouldn't suggest there is a lot of value in teaching students to draw or paint in that tradition. Maybe the value is in understanding it and using that as inspiration to create art that reflects the actual values you want to bring into the world, or maybe to illuminate the distortions innate in society today.

[Szdfan]

When I was an undergraduate English major at Goshen College, I took a class on Mennonite literature. At the time there was little Mennonite literature and poetry and most of it came from Dutch Canadian Mennonites (like Rudy Wiebe).

Part of the discussion in the class was why there was so little Mennonite literature, especially among Swiss-German Mennonites. Joseph Yoder’s Rosanna of the Amish was one of the few examples. There’s more today, but not a lot.

Two possible reasons —

1) A strong belief in “let your yay be yay and your nay be nay.” All fiction is a lie in the sense it tells stories that haven’t actually happened, even though they may be true in a philosophical or life experience way.

2) The utility of art. Art in Old Order and Conservative groups — like quilting — is both aesthetic and useful. Art that is artistic or aesthetic without a “useful” purpose has been traditionally frowned upon.

This might relate to why watercolors might be controversial in some communities.

[Ernie]

This might relate to why watercolors might be controversial in some communities.

We have yet to determine that watercolor painting is frowned on anywhere in Anabaptist communities. My only experiences have been that water coloring is encouraged.

[Ernie]

The other examples you mention seem either like efforts in frivolity (fireworks displays) or pursuits in ostentatiousness. Billion dollar cathedrals are ostentatious and miss the point. However, when I am in France I love nothing more than attending mass in some of the old churches and cathedrals in Lyon. I think we can and should pursue beauty and art that is in line with our Mennonite beliefs always with an eye towards avoiding pride, liberation, individualism and ostentation and excess.

So you are agreeing with me, correct?

When something beautiful is performed or created it necessarily draws one to God because God is the source and the standard of Beauty. Beautiful things are Good and True and those are the very attributes of God.

Do you think it is possible for something to be admired as beautiful, while at the same time rejecting the pursuit of creating such beauty, because a particular art creation is not expedient or edifying?

[Ernie]

My operating philosophy is...

A touch of heaven on earth (in the context of beauty) is good and almost necessarily. To a person who has spent months confined in a concrete cell, seeing even a single blade of grass can help him stay sane.

The Bible begins with a beautiful garden and ends with a beautiful garden. Pockets of beauty here and there remind us of God, of heaven, of what God intended.

But when such things are pursued extravagantly, (whether in terms of time, money, or other resources) and distracts a person from giving his life to the sorts of things Jesus gave his life to, then I think it robs Jesus of what he intended for his followers to be and do. The final test at the judgment is not whether we created sufficient beauty or maximum beauty, but whether or not we ministered to people like Jesus did.

[JohnH]

Many plain Anabaptists consider it more beneficial to plant gardens rather than paint pictures of them.



The plainest of Anabaptists consider it more beneficial to plant a vegetable garden than to plant flower gardens, yet even in so doing often find ways to arrange their front yard kitchen garden so that it looks attractive.