How lenient should we be to JohnL?

[JohnH]

For the record, I've enjoyed and appreciated the performance art from the people or persons who have conducted the MaxPC/JohnL account. It predated the age of AI and has involved a good deal of effort. I would not mind at all if they continued to stay, although they might have to come up with a new schtick. Whatever it is, I think they might find that truth is often stranger than fiction and that the acceptance they've had here would continue, and a few of us sceptics would no longer have anything we need to complain about.

[JohnH]

So this is information I previously did not know and that context changes things substantially. I am deeply sorry that it happened to you. I can imagine that was a frightening and frustrating experience.
It wasn’t me. I have no idea where you work. I have never tried to locate your address or employer. I have never encouraged anyone to interact or harm you in real life.

On this forum, we disagree about almost everything and don't particularly like each other. As you have previously stated, there's no trust between us.

But I think there's a huge difference between vehement online disagreement and conflict and harming each other in real life. I have no desire to harm you or your family in real life.

I'm sorry for my persistence on this issue. The fact that someone tried to harm you in real life changes my perspective and I find it now understandable why you changed your username and tried to conceal your identity. I regret that I continued pursuing the issue after you made it clear how strongly you felt about it.

I want to be clear that I do not want you harmed, unemployed or punished for your beliefs.

Thanks, Szd. I think you expressing this could make things a lot less acrimonious between us.

[Ernie]

I think this interchange is at the crux of what we are discussing here.

Did you see this question?

JohnL. Did you post on this forum in the past under the username MaxPC?

Nope never saw that question. Nope I’m not this MaxPc person. Like I said before y’all say the weirdest things. I don’t know what all is the background and I don’t really want to know. I’m just getting input from y’all on topics I’m seeing pop up in social media.

[Neto]

I 'outed myself' earlier in this thread. At the time I joined MennoDiscuss, I was going through the painful experience of (in my own self image) having 'lost my identity', and so my reaction at that time was to (stubbornly) 'claim it', not only on MD and MN, but also on the long defunct Mennonite forum where I had joined previously to MD. (I had 'met' Sudsy on that forum, and openly invited members there to join MD. Sudsy was not the only one who came onboard here, either. I had been a 'lurker' on MD during that same period of time.)

I also joined a number of old auto forums during the same time frame, all using the same user name, except one where both 'Neto' & 'Eneto' (the name for which Neto is the nickname) was already taken, so I had to use Eneto55 (on P15-D24.com, where I am still a regular forum participant). Ebay also already had Neto and Eneto listed as taken, so I'm still on there as the_real_Neto.

In a sense, Neto IS my 'real name', because that's how I'm still known by the Banawa tribal people, even those whom I have not yet met in person, because of the now many years since we have visited them. That's the identity I felt I was loosing. For a long time I never mentioned the Banawa by name, because of concerns that those who have power in Brazil in the realm of Indian Relations could use the fact that I was posting information about the Banawa in a law suit or to prevent us from ever returning there. (Such an action could have been legally be based on the Brazilian law that makes the dissemination of 'proprietary tribal knowledge' without written consent a punishable offense. At this point in time, the people are capable of legally allowing such action on our part, but that was not the case at all back in 2007 or so, when I joined MD.) I am also still known as Neto by a number of former colleagues - fellow members of Wycliffe Bible Translators, as well as some from other mission agencies.

If I were starting out now, I would probably use my legal name, or the nickname I go by here in the States (Ernie), but when the 'great purge' came about, the other Ernie was already here as a regular participant. That is, I have 'gotten over' the sense of identity loss I was going through back then, now roughly 20 years in the past. I cannot think of any reason for anyone to need to hide their actual identity. The internet spies figured out that my email addresses that use some form of Eneto are actually me, and spam me interchangeably on both 'identities' about anything I do in either. They even spam my personal FaceBook account with advertisements for stuff my wife searches for on the internet, and she has never had an FB account in her own name, and has no login permissions for mine on her computer. (I assume that this is because we are listed on the same IP Address.)

[temporal1]

My hope is for apology to admin+mods+forum, esp for faking death (in my mind, the most egregious betrayal).
A promise to not repeat it -anywhere- would be a great thing.

My prayer is for healed minds+hearts so that betrayal is unthinkable. A prayer for all.

[JohnH]

I would add that Neto is Neto to me... we already have an Ernie on this forum who is irreplaceable.

I do not begrudge anyone using pseudonyms. If someone wishes to change pseudonyms and come back, I am fine with that too. I just think people should be truthful and not make up stories about themselves, but even if someone does, it is not an "unpardonable sin". We can move on.

I would also add I have an appreciation for performance art, and even for our pet bot. AI technology is going to bring us new frontiers in deception and dishonesty.

[Szdfan]

My hope is for apology to admin+mods+forum, esp for faking death (in my mind, the most egregious betrayal).
A promise to not repeat it -anywhere- would be a great thing.

My prayer is for healed minds+hearts so that betrayal is unthinkable. A prayer for all.

I do have to agree that faking your own death to a web forum is odd behavior and the rationale for it is not clear to me. Since the cat is out of the bag and if JohnL really is Max, I’d like to hear why he thought he had to do that.

[eccentric_rambler]

I have disbelieved the MaxL character since I started reading here. I'm impressed by the willingness of some to believe, it reminds me of a dear brother from my growing up years. His motto was "Love believes all things." He was willing to believe until someone gave him a clear reason not to.

Now that the IP address overlap has been acknowledged there is clear reason not to believe that JohnL knows nothing of MaxPC. The likelihood that they used the same library? Or virtual machine? I might use the foe option to hide him. At the very least I plan not to engage unless there is some kind of coming clean.

Is it ban-worthy? I don't know, I'm just a casual here. What troubles me is the thought of new members who do not know the lore either believing him or finding his schtick irritating enough they don't stay. Perhaps the mods could edit his signature to say something like "This poster has been asked to verify his claims and has failed to do so. Any information provided should be taken with a grain of salt. See also MaxPC and [link to this thread]." It appears phpbb allows mods to lock a user's signature so that he can no longer edit it.

[ohio jones]

One option is: “Let him post.”
Is there a reason there’s not an alternate option, such as: “He shouldn’t post.” (?)

Most of the options might imply the latter. (?)

In case it's not clear, that's the last option, The Ban.

[temporal1]

One option is: “Let him post.”
Is there a reason there’s not an alternate option, such as: “He shouldn’t post.” (?)

Most of the options might imply the latter. (?)

In case it's not clear, that's the last option, The Ban.

ok.
i presume, and i hope, even with the poll, decisions by mods will be by their discretion, not poll results, alone?
(i don’t understand the forum to be a straight-up democracy.) nor do i want it so.