Anabaptist preferences around statutes of national leaders

[JohnL]

the church then and now, as a whole, has this vice that they need purged out. Hence down with the golden calves being erected to be venerated.

The Bible tells us everyone sins. The Bible tells us God’s mercy and grace is mightier than those sins if we choose to believe and live the Bible’s teachings. I stand firm in that belief and that’s why Jesus’ followers are still preaching and living the Word today even when every worldly government disappears. The Roman Empire fell. All empires and governments after the Romans have come and gone and will continue that way until Jesus returns with his kingdom.

I’ll say it again. My folks would consider you one of those people who are contrary all day long.
I say getting back to the Bible and staying focused on living the Bible’s teachings and letting God deal with other folks is the most sane way to keep our eyes on Jesus. You don’t have control over others. God didn’t give any man the power to judge others. Every man must judge himself only and seek the True Way in the Bible. Those Beatitudes are a really good place to start that.

[JohnH]

I saw a Catholic remarked that Protestants say images of dead saints are idolatry. Underneath that he had "Also Protestants" and an image of the golden statue of the living Trump being venerated in FL. Pretty well made point in my view...

Pretty poorly made point. Protestants don’t venerate or worship statues.

The preacher at that statue is from some storefront church that doesn’t even appear to have regular meeting times that I could find.

If you feel you need to rebuke him, please contact him and go ahead. I generally avoid rebukes for people outside of my denomination for a variety of reasons.

[temporal1]

i knew nothing of Ryan Holiday or his podcasts, “The Daily Stoic”. So, i question “Famous” in Rich’s headline.
i would suggest, “Self-Proclaimed” might be more accurate.

i won’t be reading, listening, viewing, beyond Rich Lowry’s video below.

Mr Holiday might feel better overall if someone fed him. Nutrition is important for mind and body.

At about the 6:20 mark, i appreciated Mr Holiday’s summation, “and you’re lucky, you get to be you”.. ..

Rich Lowry / “The Famous Stoic Who Has Trump Derangement Syndrome” / -10min


This video reminds of lots of MN discourse. Maybe others are familiar with Mr Lowry Holiday.

i believe this topic expands on:
Trump statue
https://forum.mennonet.com/viewtopic.php?t=8890

[Bootstrap]

I would personally say what I said above about any leader that had evangelicals or other religious leaders dedicating a statue that is of that leader. But to my knowledge we have not had a statue of a living political figure put up and dedicated in this way, at least not in my lifetime.

Even dead American presidents don't have gold statues.

Okay, so your objection is the particular metals used? Have you also lodged an objection with the gold-plated (well, gold-leafed - it's wood) statue of George Washington at the Idaho capitol building?

I see you created a whole new thread for this. But obviously, my concern is not just what the material is.

Gold has a certain significance - and it is certainly significant to Trump. Receiving gifts that appeal to your personal vanity from people in crypto, while you and your family are making money from crypto, while you are campaigning to make it hard to regulate crypto ... that also has a certain significance.

So do personality cults. We don't usually play "Glory to Our Supreme Leader" in the United States. There's a big shift there. I'll start a thread on the real issue as I see it. You have a tendency to try to shift the conversation to some other topic of your choice, putting into other people's mouths. This thread is an exercise in that. So I'll start my own thread to express my own point of view.

[Ernie]

I generally avoid rebukes for people outside of my denomination for a variety of reasons.

Except for the constant rebuking here on MN?

[JohnH]

I generally avoid rebukes for people outside of my denomination for a variety of reasons.

Except for the constant rebuking here on MN?

I have delivered very few direct rebukes to a specific person here on MN. Otherwise. This is a discussion forum.

[Bootstrap]

I generally avoid rebukes for people outside of my denomination for a variety of reasons.

Except for the constant rebuking here on MN?

I have delivered very few direct rebukes to a specific person here on MN. Otherwise. This is a discussion forum.

So many of your posts do one of two things:

1. Tell stories, real or imagined, about what is wrong with the person who expresses a view, and insisting on making the topic about your accusations, not the topic.
2. Put words into someone else's mouth, as though they had said it, mocking them for saying or something that you wrote, and insisting on discussing that instead of what they actually did say.

Makes actual discussion rather difficult. Makes it hard to even focus on the facts or the issues or whatever it is that we are trying to discuss. This particular topic, in more than one thread, is a good example.

[JohnH]

Except for the constant rebuking here on MN?

I have delivered very few direct rebukes to a specific person here on MN. Otherwise. This is a discussion forum.

So many of your posts do one of two things:

1. Tell stories, real or imagined, about what is wrong with the person who expresses a view, and insisting on making the topic about your accusations, not the topic.
2. Put words into someone else's mouth, as though they had said it, mocking them for saying or something that you wrote, and insisting on discussing that instead of what they actually did say.

Makes actual discussion rather difficult. Makes it hard to even focus on the facts or the issues or whatever it is that we are trying to discuss. This particular topic, in more than one thread, is a good example.

Boot,

I simply disagree with your mischaracterisation of me.

I feel like you don’t like any pushback against certain opinions you hold, and feel frustrated when someone else comes in with solid facts and evidence. That’s not “telling imaginary stories”.

Likewise, quoting someone isn’t “putting words in their mouth”.

It does mean that your view can’t predominant simply because you are good at rhetoric and at writing seemingly well reasoned arguments for things. On this particular topic, I’ve simply asked if people held Jimmy Carter’s statue to the same standard as this one, and there isn’t even any engagement on that topic. The topic is simply another “orange man bad” from people who don’t like a certain President, and then it’s agreement with me from people who do like a certain President.

And it’s quite toxic. I laid out questions of what our attitude towards statues really is. I think that would be worth discussing.

The fact I have not delivered a personal rebuke to Mark Burns is not worth discussing. I don’t deliver rebukes to people I don’t know and have no relationship with.

[barnhart]

the church then and now, as a whole, has this vice that they need purged out. Hence down with the golden calves being erected to be venerated.

The Bible tells us everyone sins. The Bible tells us God’s mercy and grace is mightier than those sins if we choose to believe and live the Bible’s teachings. I stand firm in that belief and that’s why Jesus’ followers are still preaching and living the Word today even when every worldly government disappears. The Roman Empire fell. All empires and governments after the Romans have come and gone and will continue that way until Jesus returns with his kingdom.

...I say getting back to the Bible and staying focused on living the Bible’s teachings and letting God deal with other folks is the most sane way to keep our eyes on Jesus. You don’t have control over others. God didn’t give any man the power to judge others. Every man must judge himself only and seek the True Way in the Bible. Those Beatitudes are a really good place to start that.

I agree with this including the part about controlling others, which is why I am concerned about the gold statue celebrating type of Christians. I can't see their enthusiasm in any other light than power and control but all I can do is raise a voice of concern.

[JayP]

I have significantly withdrawn form regular reading and contributions, but peek to see if much as changed.

So someone points out JohnH’s foibles and…shockingly…John disagrees!
At least I had my laugh for the day.

I usually just look at the long board lists of topics to see how regularly you get the last “word” (post) in for.
They are lucky to have a guy posting that is an expert in virtually everything.

I will say a prayer for Mrs John.