Zionism, Replacement Theology, or Other

[RDD]

Forgive me if this has been dealt with before.

The intent of this conversation is theological and not political.

Is the current state of Israel God’s chosen people as taught in the majority of evangelical Christian churches or has God’s covenant with Israel been reissued to the church?

[JohnH]

Forgive me if this has been dealt with before.

The intent of this conversation is theological and not political.

Is the current state of Israel God’s chosen people as taught in the majority of evangelical Christian churches or has God’s covenant with Israel been reissued to the church?

Well, ask two people about that and you’ll get 3 opinions.

I believe God has now extended his promise all peoples, not just Abraham’s children, available to all through Jesus’ invitation to be adopted sons who cry, “Abba! Father!”

[cmbl]

Forgive me if this has been dealt with before.

The intent of this conversation is theological and not political.

Is the current state of Israel God’s chosen people as taught in the majority of evangelical Christian churches or has God’s covenant with Israel been reissued to the church?

The most conservative Mennonites (Old Order, Washington County) have maintained their amillenial outlook and do not believe the current state of Israel is God's chosen people. Less conservative but still Plain Mennonites such as Eastern, Pilgrim, Mid-Atlantic, etc., are more influenced by dispensationalism; many would believe that there are outstanding promises to Israel. (These churches have also had a minority of amillenial people since dispensationalism came in; furthermore, the level of fervor and prophetic speculation has decreased from what it was a generation or two ago.)

[cmbl]

This thread goes into a bit more of the history of this in Mennonite churches.

[Neto]

Forgive me if this has been dealt with before.

The intent of this conversation is theological and not political.

Is the current state of Israel God’s chosen people as taught in the majority of evangelical Christian churches or has God’s covenant with Israel been reissued to the church?

I would say Neither. The secular state of Israel is not (in my understanding of Scripture) the 'Children of God', nor has 'the church' replaced Israel in terms of the promises of God to them. Jesus told his disciples that he had "other sheep not of this (Israelite) fold, and that he must go and BRING them, that there would be one fold, and one Shepherd. The fold is the People of God, and Jesus himself is the Good Shepherd. Bringing the others means that those who are not of that fold (True Israel - the 'remnant' that were 'looking for the redemption of Israel') join the original fold, not the other way around. Nor do those 'other sheep' take the place of the 'sheep of Israel'.

[barnhart]

Less conservative but still Plain Mennonites such as Eastern, Pilgrim, Mid-Atlantic, etc., are more influenced by dispensationalism; many would believe that there are outstanding promises to Israel. (These churches have also had a minority of amillenial people since dispensationalism came in; furthermore, the level of fervor and prophetic speculation has decreased from what it was a generation or two ago.)

My experience has been among these churches there is no consensus so there is tolerance for multiple views on eschatology.

[barnhart]

Forgive me if this has been dealt with before.

The intent of this conversation is theological and not political.

Is the current state of Israel God’s chosen people as taught in the majority of evangelical Christian churches or has God’s covenant with Israel been reissued to the church?

I would say Neither. The secular state of Israel is not (in my understanding of Scripture) the 'Children of God', nor has 'the church' replaced Israel in terms of the promises of God to them. Jesus told his disciples that he had "other sheep not of this (Israelite) fold, and that he must go and BRING them, that there would be one fold, and one Shepherd. The fold is the People of God, and Jesus himself is the Good Shepherd. Bringing the others means that those who are not of that fold (True Israel - the 'remnant' that were 'looking for the redemption of Israel') join the original fold, not the other way around. Nor do those 'other sheep' take the place of the 'sheep of Israel'.

Well said.

[Ernie]

Replacement Theology is one of those terms like Antinomianism. I don't know of anyone who claims to believe in Replacement Theology or Antinomianism. Both are terms that people with certain beliefs typically use in a pejorative way to describe others with different beliefs.

I don't believe that any group of people replaces or can replace anyone else.

If I was to describe my beliefs, I might use the terms "fulfillment theology" or "covenant theology".

[Ernie]

Less conservative but still Plain Mennonites such as Eastern, Pilgrim, Mid-Atlantic, etc., are more influenced by dispensationalism; many would believe that there are outstanding promises to Israel. (These churches have also had a minority of amillenial people since dispensationalism came in; furthermore, the level of fervor and prophetic speculation has decreased from what it was a generation or two ago.)

My experience has been among these churches there is no consensus so there is tolerance for multiple views on eschatology.

I don't mind people having personal opinions on these things as long as they state it as such.
But when they elevate their opinions to a theological position, school of thought, accepted teaching, confessional teaching, authoritative teaching, doctrine, or dogma, then I think they go too far.

[Ernie]

Several months ago I received an email from Europe. Here is an excerpt from that email...

"My wife and I are looking for a church. We would also like to emigrate. The following points are important to us.

The church should be pre-millennial, or better yet, dispensational, meaning they believe in a pre-rapture, how many years before the return in power and glory, is not a major concern for us. The fact that there is a seven-year tribulation period in the future, followed by a 1,000-year kingdom of peace on earth, and that the people of Israel according to the flesh (12 tribes) have a future and that one-third of them will be saved, as stated in Zechariah 13:8-9. Therefore, we reject replacement theology. There may be fellow believers in the church who believe this way, but it should not be taught, or at least not be the church's doctrine."

I sigh.