Civil War-again?

[Valerie]

I am not aware of "a lot". Anyway how is it a wise step to return if you cannot provide a living for your family, there's gang violence, etc. or worse, you have to fear that the US military may strike your fishing boat?

There's gang violence in the U.S. too.

Yeah, I was born in Los Angeles County, Dad moved us out of our city as there were gangs even in the 60s (Mexican) so we moved to Orange County in a new community but still we had gangs at my high school known to carry switchblades & we were nervous about using the restroom at school as you never knew who was in there.

[Neto]

.....
If ICE withdraws, the violence stops. Why not do that?

Does it? From what I've seen on the BBC (which people I know who mainly use Fox News say is 'liberal news'), many or perhaps even most of the illegals they are targeting are already wanted for more serious crimes, some going back decades.

Yes, stopping the effort to apprehend these people who are guilty of other crimes (that is, other than illegal presence in the country) will stop the violence connected with ICE operations, but it doesn't appear that it will stop the other crimes, like assault & battery, robbery, rape, and murder.

So far, the highly-visual violence is connected with 'professional bystanders' attempting to block the apprehension of these known criminals.

(I don't "have a dog in this fight". The recent immigrants I know are not violent offenders. Are they here legally? I do not know, nor do I ask. My objective is not to find out that information - I'd rather befriend them, and hope to be able to present Christ to them, and if I find that they are already following Jesus, to fellowship with them. Their legal status here is something that the Holy Spirit can take care of, and while their deportation would terminate any opportunity to do these things, nor will I stand in the way of governmental action, either.)

EDIT:
[Oh, and as to earlier references to the War Between the States, I don't think the divisions in that case were as clear cut as some think. There was also a good deal of internal conflicts within not only states, counties, and communities, but within families & friendships as well.]

[Bootstrap]

.....
If ICE withdraws, the violence stops. Why not do that?

Does it? From what I've seen on the BBC (which people I know who mainly use Fox News say is 'liberal news'), many or perhaps even most of the illegals they are targeting are already wanted for more serious crimes, some going back decades.

Yes, stopping the effort to apprehend these people who are guilty of other crimes (that is, other than illegal presence in the country) will stop the violence connected with ICE operations, but it doesn't appear that it will stop the other crimes, like assault & battery, robbery, rape, and murder.

Deporting violent criminals is a good idea. But no reliable source I can find says that's what they are doing.

I would be interested in links to the BBC reporting you are talking about, because I do think the BBC is generally careful with facts.

Here are some of the things I am seeing:

https://www.fox9.com/news/ice-minnesota ... d-jan-2026

When you look at the overall number of more than 2,000 arrests in Minnesota, 5.2% of those arrested in ICE operations in recent weeks are violent criminals.

https://www.cato.org/blog/5-ice-detaine ... onvictions

5% of People Detained By ICE Have Violent Convictions, 73% No Convictions

That's a BIG change. Before, most of the people detained by ICE had criminal convictions, often serious ones.

[Bootstrap]

So far, the highly-visual violence is connected with 'professional bystanders' attempting to block the apprehension of these known criminals.

I don’t think that’s true.

Videos and reporting show tear gas, pepper spray, and less-lethal rounds being used on people who were observing, filming, chanting, or protesting, not physically blocking arrests. Authorities often say force was to "stop obstruction", but the videos and images usually show force used on crowds who weren’t blocking anything.

In the two most recent fatal shootings, neither person was trying to block an arrest. Renee Good was in her car, and Alex Pretti was filming and trying to help someone, not stopping officers from making an arrest.

If they had been trying to block apprehension - and they were not - agents could use reasonable force to stop that obstruction. But that doesn't mean shooting them.

[Bootstrap]

Oh, and as to earlier references to the War Between the States, I don't think the divisions in that case were as clear cut as some think. There was also a good deal of internal conflicts within not only states, counties, and communities, but within families & friendships as well.

I absolutely agree with you on that.

There were also Mennonites who fought in that war, FWIW.

[JimFoxvog]

No, he’s not a felon he is THE PRESIDENT of THE UNITED STATES ...
...

Someone convicted of 34 felonies is not a felon? Each felony can result in a year or more of prison time. I would have recommended mercifully only giving him a year for each one. The only reason he was not convicted of more was due to political power. Listen to Jack Smith's testimony.

We pray. We vote. We trust the good Lord.

Yes. We can agree on some things!

[Neto]

So far, the highly-visual violence is connected with 'professional bystanders' attempting to block the apprehension of these known criminals.

I don’t think that’s true.

Videos and reporting show tear gas, pepper spray, and less-lethal rounds being used on people who were observing, filming, chanting, or protesting, not physically blocking arrests. Authorities often say force was to "stop obstruction", but the videos and images usually show force used on crowds who weren’t blocking anything.

In the two most recent fatal shootings, neither person was trying to block an arrest. Renee Good was in her car, and Alex Pretti was filming and trying to help someone, not stopping officers from making an arrest.

If they had been trying to block apprehension - and they were not - agents could use reasonable force to stop that obstruction. But that doesn't mean shooting them.

Good had gone there to track and block the agents. (She used her car.)

I don't remember what day it was when I saw the report on illegals who were also wanted for violent crimes. If no one else saw that, fine; forget I wrote that. I certainly did read that, but I don't chose to pursue it further.

[Southerner]

There were also Mennonites who fought in that war, FWIW.

Very few Mennonites fought in the Civil War. Jacob Hildebrand of Augusta County, VA was sympathetic to the Confederacy and his sons fought under Lee but I don't think they were members. Jacob supplied food and other supplies to his sons when they were in the Northern VA Army which was atypical.

[JohnL]

This ice storm has us staying put and boredom is settling into our bones. If I get too bored I’ll get a wild hair and hobble through the house tearing off the labels on all the mattresses. I’m guessing our law enforcement is too busy to care. If they come knocking I might have to get my wife to drive while I flee for the hills. She’s a pretty good driver too.

[Valerie]

No, he’s not a felon he is THE PRESIDENT of THE UNITED STATES ...
...

Someone convicted of 34 felonies is not a felon? Each felony can result in a year or more of prison time. I would have recommended mercifully only giving him a year for each one. The only reason he was not convicted of more was due to political power. Listen to Jack Smith's testimony.

We pray. We vote. We trust the good Lord.

Yes. We can agree on some things!

No, add to your list violently protesting. So we don’t agree. Obstruction & impeding. That’s what your side does. Defend lawlessness. Violently breaking into Church service last week is NOT praying, it was motivated by an anti-Christ spirit.