Mary’s Maturity

[Valerie]

My grandma was self-sufficient and indeed growing her own food (with enough left over to give away) by age 16. My grandpa worked full time on river dredging boats by age 12.

Now we have people clutching their pearls about the idea of letting kids walk themselves to school.

My grandmother’s father left his family when she was 9. Her mother then had to go to work. My grandmother had to quit school at 9 yo to take care of the other children. She had a lot of responsibility.
My mother & her sister had to do EVERYTHING to “run the house” when they were in grade school as my grandparents worked. The Great Depression was really tough on families but I can certainly see the value in both my grandmother and my mother as far as handling life’s toughest situations and still having joy. There’s no way in the world I can imagine most of the young people I work with being able to cope with the situation that people used to have to. My mom says she just didn’t know any different. She was married at 17 and started her family right away. There’s not many people I admire more in life.

[JohnL]

When life is hard and life is short children grow up fast. In Mary’s day I think the average life span was something like 40-45 years? Based on that Mary was almost middle aged by the time she was 15.

[JohnH]

When life is hard and life is short children grow up fast. In Mary’s day I think the average life span was something like 40-45 years? Based on that Mary was almost middle aged by the time she was 15.

So I guess life isn’t hard anymore?

[Ernie]

I think the ancient Eastern Orthodox Church (which goes back to the apostles time) has a lot of historical records for example I have an orthodox study Bible and in the footnotes I learn a lot about people like the woman at the well and Zaccheaus, etc., about what their lives became after those written instances in the scripture. So they do have history they do know of Mary’s parents, their names, etc.

They have a number of historical records, but most of what they mention is just supposition.

[barnhart]

Just saying from reading the other topics it seems our youth are so less mature for their age than they used to be.
I wonder why?

We live in a highly infantilized era where modern society dictates that adolescence lasts until age 25 and continues to call developing men and women "children." This is something that a very famous psychologist named Carl Jung called the phenomenon of the puer aeternus, the child-men, one of the greatest problems of modern society

Also, in that era, life expectancy was much lower and infant mortality was high, which is why people were accustomed to assuming adult responsibilities much earlier.

My analysis would include a look at the cult of youth, people refusing to accept aging as a rebellion against mortality. In this world view truth and beauty are found in an independent stage where the individual is not troubled by the very young and the very old. In this world aging, marriage and children are negative influences that should be avoided or at least delayed into an unspecified future. Accepting responsibility, aging and children are markers of surrender to mortality so they bravely fight on with dyed hair and grim determination...

On the other hand I wouldn't say moving the age as low as possible is healthy either. Intense structural poverty can for children to take on adult responsibilities extremely young and that can be equally harmful.

[Soloist]

I think the ancient Eastern Orthodox Church (which goes back to the apostles time) has a lot of historical records for example I have an orthodox study Bible and in the footnotes I learn a lot about people like the woman at the well and Zaccheaus, etc., about what their lives became after those written instances in the scripture. So they do have history they do know of Mary’s parents, their names, etc.

They have a number of historical records, but most of what they mention is just supposition.

Wife: do the records point around 15 or is that just a guess? i’ve heard modern-day people talk about how she might have been just a tweenager like 11 to 13(personally, I think that’s just for shock factor to make her sound like a child bride), and there’s no way of knowing, but I would personally guess 14 or older just because I wouldn’t think that young of girls would necessarily have commonly gone through puberty back in those days with less food, etc..

I personally think the Holy Spirit is speaking through her, but she definitely has a lot of maturity at a younger age than we would see right now. She lived in a culture where death, struggle and poverty were common, and they were second class citizens to the Romans.

[temporal1]

Because of my family’s Catholicism, i’ve read about a number of saints, one thing i noticed is how many faced grueling hardships as children and teens, yet chose abiding faith; honestly, much like early Anabaptists. It’s profoundly humbling. One example:

José Luis Sánchez del Río / 14 years old
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DRYAJ-ij-gQ/

chris_immaculatamilitia WROTE:
Meet José Luis Sánchez del Río – The Boy Who Died for Christ the King.

At just 14 years old, José Del Río joined the Cristeros—a movement of brave Catholics who stood against the violent persecution of the Church in Mexico in the 1920s. Despite his age, he begged to join the fight for ¡Viva Cristo Rey! (“Long live Christ the King!”)

Captured by government forces, José refused to renounce his faith.
They tortured him brutally—cutting the soles of his feet and forcing him to walk to his grave. Bleeding and suffering, he still shouted with every step: “Viva Cristo Rey!”

i can’t disconnect the work of God through the Holy Spirit, and i believe God bestows design and gifts from conception, even before conception.

i tell my family, you are God’s creation (as we all are). thus, the sanctity of life.

parents are entrusted in many ways, with protection, nurturing, guiding, and more. God creates.
i think of parenting in terms of, “FIRST, DO NO HARM” - [try not to!!]

i also tell them, from young, only God is perfect. parents do our best, we make mistakes. God is central and first.
of course the best way to convey that message is to live it.

children can be very conscientious and tender. the present world often tries to beat it out of them.

i tell my family, i love who they are. most important to me is their souls and spirits.
God only knows how they will be tested, and if i will be present for them. i want them to know where to turn if i’m present or not.
to me, it’s more important, more valuable than commercial life insurance.

[mike]

I think the ancient Eastern Orthodox Church (which goes back to the apostles time) has a lot of historical records for example I have an orthodox study Bible and in the footnotes I learn a lot about people like the woman at the well and Zaccheaus, etc., about what their lives became after those written instances in the scripture. So they do have history they do know of Mary’s parents, their names, etc.

They have a number of historical records, but most of what they mention is just supposition.

Catholics and EOs also "know" other things that aren't in scripture, or are even contradicted by scripture, such as the idea that Jesus had no siblings.

[Valerie]

I think the ancient Eastern Orthodox Church (which goes back to the apostles time) has a lot of historical records for example I have an orthodox study Bible and in the footnotes I learn a lot about people like the woman at the well and Zaccheaus, etc., about what their lives became after those written instances in the scripture. So they do have history they do know of Mary’s parents, their names, etc.

They have a number of historical records, but most of what they mention is just supposition.

Catholics and EOs also "know" other things that aren't in scripture, or are even contradicted by scripture, such as the idea that Jesus had no siblings.

They believe that the siblings of Jesus were not born at Mary, but Joseph brought them into the marriage that he was a widower. So they would’ve been older than Jesus not younger. It is interesting that when Jesus was on the cross, he entrusted his mother to the apostle John, who was not one of the siblings. It would not have been customary for him to do that when there were other younger children of her own that could’ve taken Mary under their shelter, but the apostle John took Mary with him to Ephesus and that’s where she lived out the rest of her life.

[Ernie]

They have a number of historical records, but most of what they mention is just supposition.

Catholics and EOs also "know" other things that aren't in scripture, or are even contradicted by scripture, such as the idea that Jesus had no siblings.

They believe that the siblings of Jesus were not born at Mary, but Joseph brought them into the marriage that he was a widower. So they would’ve been older than Jesus not younger. It is interesting that when Jesus was on the cross, he entrusted his mother to the apostle John, who was not one of the siblings. It would not have been customary for him to do that when there were other younger children of her own that could’ve taken Mary under their shelter, but the apostle John took Mary with him to Ephesus and that’s where she lived out the rest of her life.

Yes, there are many things we could suppose.