Russia Invades Ukraine 2022

[Ernie]

Whoever would have guessed three years ago, whenever this thread was started, following the shocking news that Russia had invaded Ukraine, that on the third anniversary of the war, the US would be siding with Russia, and campaigning against Ukraine at the U.N. Security Council to try to prevent passage of a resolution condemning Russia for invading Ukraine.

Also,
"Stephen Feinberg, President Trump’s pick to be deputy secretary of Defense, declined to say during his confirmation hearing on Tuesday whether Russia invaded Ukraine."
https://thehill.com/policy/defense/5163 ... a-ukraine/

[Soloist]

I don’t know which is worse… giving a pretense of supporting them to hurt Russia, or abandoning them now.

Our strategy was never designed to help them win against Russia.
From a destroy Russia, It was great plan.
From a help Ukraine fight off Russia… why did we string them along for 3 years without enough support?

Why did EU do the exact same thing?

Trump is definitely changing things, but let’s not make America’s half hearted support as though we actually wanted them to win.
We wanted Russia to lose. Trump apparently wants Russia to win now.

[Neto]

Whoever would have guessed three years ago, whenever this thread was started, following the shocking news that Russia had invaded Ukraine, that on the third anniversary of the war, the US would be siding with Russia, and campaigning against Ukraine at the U.N. Security Council to try to prevent passage of a resolution condemning Russia for invading Ukraine.

Also,
"Stephen Feinberg, President Trump’s pick to be deputy secretary of Defense, declined to say during his confirmation hearing on Tuesday whether Russia invaded Ukraine."
https://thehill.com/policy/defense/5163 ... a-ukraine/

Some people now-a-days don't know what a woman is, and some don't know what a dictator is.

[Ernie]

I'm wondering if the blow up at the oval office this past week is a good thing for Ukraine in that the US/Russia are no longer heading up the deal making, and Ukraine and Europe are now back in charge of coming up with a plan.

From an earthly kingdoms point of view, Russia is the invader and no deal needs to be made with them to keep some of Ukraine.

I liked Macron's statement to the press immediately after the blowup at the oval office.

"There is an aggressor which is Russia. There is an aggressed people which is Ukraine."

[temporal1]

Another busy Ukraine thread: lots of discussion

“Russia and US should decide Ukraine's fate?”
viewtopic.php?t=7631&start=170

P.18:

Now after the negative reactions from his own government and calling for his ouster Z-man is begging for a deal with the US again.
Zelensky thanks U.S., wants minerals agreement

It’s easy to believe majority Ukrainians want RESOLUTION. It’s unlikely their opinions will be known.

The White House meeting was planned to sign the minerals agreement.
If Z decided he wanted more, he should have negotiated this before, OR CANCELLED THE MEETING.

Frankly (i believe) his display was a pelosi-like setup and ambush, and was successful in causing DISRUPTION.
My opinion of Z is even lower than before.

Z left the meeting, making a bee-line to Starmer.

Reuters / “UK, France and Ukraine will present peace deal to Trump, Starmer says”
https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/uks-st ... 025-03-02/

They want what they want, and they want U.S. to pay for it.
Also, no credit to Trump. That’s key.

Personally, i don’t care who TAKES credit, i pray for resolution. To save bloodshed.
The facts are, years ago, Trump counseled Z to find a path to AVOID military conflict; after years of conflict, Trump is trying to clean up the mess. Regardless of who TAKES credit, Trump deserves credit.

P.16: As VIVA FREI questions in the above video, for those hankering to “support Ukraine” in military funding -
will you go there to fight? Send your sons and daughters? Congress takes a lot of criticism for sending others’ sons+daughters to war, not their own.

i think it’s always an important question. who will sacrifice+die? it’s not a video game.

Some question why the passion for Ukraine’s borders, none for U.S. borders? (Serbia’s?) ..
Ukraine seems quite “special” when it comes to hundreds of billions of dollars, in what other scenario has vast sums been so easily distributed from the U.S. public treasury? “The faucet is ON.” “Z kindly thanks you.”

Ordinary taxpayers want to know.

[JohnH]

I'm wondering if the blow up at the oval office this past week is a good thing for Ukraine in that the US/Russia are no longer heading up the deal making, and Ukraine and Europe are now back in charge of coming up with a plan.

From an earthly kingdoms point of view, Russia is the invader and no deal needs to be made with them to keep some of Ukraine.

I liked Macron's statement to the press immediately after the blowup at the oval office.

"There is an aggressor which is Russia. There is an aggressed people which is Ukraine."

It doesn’t matter who the aggressor is. It matters who’s powerful enough to win. Diplomacy means persuading a powerful enemy to stop fighting instead of just continuing war to the bitter end.

The question is making a deal with Russia to stop the war now, or continuing it until Russia gets way more territory.
I don’t think the second option is a good idea.

[Southerner]

I'm wondering if the blow up at the oval office this past week is a good thing for Ukraine in that the US/Russia are no longer heading up the deal making, and Ukraine and Europe are now back in charge of coming up with a plan.

From an earthly kingdoms point of view, Russia is the invader and no deal needs to be made with them to keep some of Ukraine.

I liked Macron's statement to the press immediately after the blowup at the oval office.

"There is an aggressor which is Russia. There is an aggressed people which is Ukraine."

I also liked Macron's statement. And I find Trump's statement, "This war should have never started" so pointless. Why does he say this to Zelensky? Call Putin and tell him that the war shouldn't have started. 20000 Ukrainian children were abducted by Russia, the bombs are still flying and Trump travels to FL to golf and Vance travels to VT to ski. They should apologize to Zelensky.

[JohnH]

I'm wondering if the blow up at the oval office this past week is a good thing for Ukraine in that the US/Russia are no longer heading up the deal making, and Ukraine and Europe are now back in charge of coming up with a plan.

From an earthly kingdoms point of view, Russia is the invader and no deal needs to be made with them to keep some of Ukraine.

I liked Macron's statement to the press immediately after the blowup at the oval office.

"There is an aggressor which is Russia. There is an aggressed people which is Ukraine."

I also liked Macron's statement. And I find Trump's statement, "This war should have never started" so pointless. Why does he say this to Zelensky? Call Putin and tell him that the war shouldn't have started. 20000 Ukrainian children were abducted by Russia, the bombs are still flying and Trump travels to FL to golf and Vance travels to VT to ski. They should apologize to Zelensky.

The war started because Biden’s weakness left an opening. It’s rather obvious that Putin decided not to invade when Trump was President.

When Obama was in office Putin just marched into Crimea and took it. Weak American Presidents embolden foreign strongmen to take what they want, because they know there will be no consequences.

[temporal1]

I'm wondering if the blow up at the oval office this past week is a good thing for Ukraine in that the US/Russia are no longer heading up the deal making, and Ukraine and Europe are now back in charge of coming up with a plan.

From an earthly kingdoms point of view, Russia is the invader and no deal needs to be made with them to keep some of Ukraine.

I liked Macron's statement to the press immediately after the blowup at the oval office.
"There is an aggressor which is Russia. There is an aggressed people which is Ukraine."

I also liked Macron's statement. And I find Trump's statement, "This war should have never started" so pointless. Why does he say this to Zelensky? Call Putin and tell him that the war shouldn't have started. 20000 Ukrainian children were abducted by Russia, the bombs are still flying and Trump travels to FL to golf and Vance travels to VT to ski. They should apologize to Zelensky.

In substance, Macron’s statement has been endlessly repeated for 3 years. It’s correct, undeniable, but offers no resolution.
Is it meant to be justification for “never say die?”

If the meeting isn’t understood in context of the history of Trump and Z, such judgments are understandable.

i understand Trump’s words, “it should have never started” as sheer grief, and i agree. (because i know he advised prevention BEFORE it started.) he grieves it wasn’t prevented. and is now making effort to find resolution, starting with an immediate ceasefire.

Trump suggested immediate ceasefire to Z several times. Z pouted with his signature dark countenance and body language.

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Welcome to MN.
looking forward to reading more from you.

[temporal1]

It doesn’t matter who the aggressor is. It matters who’s powerful enough to win. Diplomacy means persuading a powerful enemy to stop fighting instead of just continuing war to the bitter end.

The question is making a deal with Russia to stop the war now, or continuing it until Russia gets way more territory.
I don’t think the second option is a good idea.