Brian Thompson Murder

[JohnH]

The support for the shooter must be significant if the PA governor has to come out against it publicly.

This quote from the Governor is worth considering and I wish it could get more mileage around the country.

“But I have no tolerance, nor should anyone, for one man using an illegal ghost gun to murder someone because he thinks his opinion matters most,” he continued. “In a civil society, we are all less safe when ideologues engage in vigilante justice.”

Would it somehow be better if he had been murdered with a 100% legal, fully licensed and legally purchased gun?

[JohnH]

The McDonald's restaurants in the area are all getting swamped with negative reviews due to the employee who called police on the shooter.

This is democracy gone bad. I wish I had hopes of good democracy returning to the USA in the future.

The vigilanti spirit seems to be with us. Shooting people to express your rage is not a form of democracy.

Instead of just saying "these people are wrong to react that way", perhaps it is worth wondering why there has been such a uniform reaction to this

I find saying "good democracy" and "bad democracy" a bit concerning too. There is just democracy. The alternative is ignoring the will and voice of the people, and just because we don't like what the people are saying and thinking... doesn't make some kind of undemocratic rule ok.

[JohnH]

Indeed. And I would take it one step further: closing your heart to people on one side or the other, withdrawing any real compassion, is a huge part of our modern politics. It's dehumanization. "These people don't deserve any compassion, they deserve whatever they get". Sometimes said about someone who has recently been killed.

If it is driven by a deep-seated disdain, it veers into hate.

It doesn't matter which "side" is doing it, it's bad. And terribly non-Christian.

In my life I have had and shown a lot of compassion to drug addicts specifically. Unfortunately many of the friends or acquaintances I had, ended up dying, due to the bad effects of their addiction. My compassion or concern could not save them

It is a reality to simply accept, that those who choose addiction and drugs, often have already forfeited their life even whilst they still live. A very difficult thing to accept.

Likewise, with a powerful CEO... executives of big companies... who have had very negative impacts on millions of people and even caused deaths, I can feel compassion just like Jesus did for the rich, young ruler:

Looking at him, Jesus showed love to him and said to him, “One thing you lack: go and sell all you possess and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.” But he was deeply dismayed by these words, and he went away grieving; for he was one who owned much property.

Not even the love of Jesus shown face to face could overcome the filthy lure of lucre, and it indeed leads many to destruction. Another reality is that when one chooses to live and walk in circles making millions of dollars, selling stocks for millions of dollars, profiting off of squeezing every dollar from health care... much like Mr Neely, one has in a sense abandoned their own humanity and chosen to create lots of enemies.

I believe we could show compassion for both people, by telling them Jesus does love them and can save, and they can live a life free of addiction, exploitation, harming the poor, sick, and elderly for personal gain, the pursuit of wealth, the pursuit of a "high", and walk away from that life into a quiet and simple life.

[ken_sylvania]

Tom Dickey from Altoona is representing him.

I'm amazed that someone would be willing to take on a case like this that has so much evidence.

Why shouldn't they? America is supposed to be a nation of laws, and this alleged murderer has every bit as much right to due process as any other accused.

[ken_sylvania]

Was what Mangione did any worse that what United Health has been doing? When United Health puts hurdles in the way of treatment that results in patient deaths, is it somehow more acceptable because their focus was on making money instead of intending to kill the patient?

I would suggest that the widespread disregard for health and human life demonstrated by large corporations (and by their CEOs, boards, and other corporate officers) is currently a much bigger problem and much more corrosive to society than acts of vigilantism.

I suspect that some of those who cheered for Mangione to escape are simply upset that the government cares so little about the people that they let the corporations get away with killing people all day long.

[R7ehr]

In America, killing somebody for pain is very illegal, but killing thousands for profit is very legal.

[JohnL]

It’s going to be interesting if this discussion about Mangione, corporate health greed, etc gets addressed by the new cabinet members come January 21.

Was what Mangione did any worse that what United Health has been doing? When United Health puts hurdles in the way of treatment that results in patient deaths, is it somehow more acceptable because their focus was on making money instead of intending to kill the patient?

I would suggest that the widespread disregard for health and human life demonstrated by large corporations (and by their CEOs, boards, and other corporate officers) is currently a much bigger problem and much more corrosive to society than acts of vigilantism.

I suspect that some of those who cheered for Mangione to escape are simply upset that the government cares so little about the people that they let the corporations get away with killing people all day long.

[temporal1]

Before this sinks any lower, it’s well to remember, “2 wrongs do not make 1 right”.

Tom Dickey from Altoona is representing him. https://www.youtube
I'm amazed that someone would be willing to take on a case like this that has so much evidence.

Why shouldn't they? America is supposed to be a nation of laws, and this alleged murderer has every bit as much right to due process as any other accused.

Yes, and, as frustrating as it can be, there is a need to ensure all is done correctly so as to avoid the guilty from escape of accountability by mistrial or technicality.

It can be hard to imagine how some defense attorneys can sleep at night.

[HondurasKeiser]

Have other unsolved murders in NYC been pursued with this many resources?

Or only murders of the wealthy and powerful?

The Jordan Neely case was pursued with alacrity,

If these murders can be seen as archetypes, we can observe the right is OK with the deaths of the poor and dispossessed and the left is OK with the deaths of the rich and powerful.

I thought you didn’t care so much for that Left-Right paradigm?

More to the point, I don’t think it’s quite that simple. These killings have been coded left or right by the various media outlets but I’ve read lots of left-leaning people that thought Daniel Penny was not guilty of anything. Likewise, the article I linked to the other day focused specifically in on the right-leaning folk, some from not so fringe media, that seemed to think Brian Thompson got what he deserved.

[barnhart]

The Jordan Neely case was pursued with alacrity,

If these murders can be seen as archetypes, we can observe the right is OK with the deaths of the poor and dispossessed and the left is OK with the deaths of the rich and powerful.

I thought you didn’t care so much for that Left-Right paradigm?

More to the point, I don’t think it’s quite that simple. These killings have been coded left or right by the various media outlets but I’ve read lots of left-leaning people that thought Daniel Penny was not guilty of anything. Likewise, the article I linked to the other day focused specifically in on the right-leaning folk, some from not so fringe media, that seemed to think Brian Thompson got what he deserved.

There are limits to the left/ right paradigm as you observe. It is still measuring something, even though I don't think it is what it claims to be, ie. the two groups are largely distinct but for different reasons and along different fault lines than either "side" admits. I propose it was always so in the US context. Being "left" was not defined by a rejection of God and biblical authority as in the French Revolution where the categories were invented. On average the American revolutionaries were churchmen who wanted local autonomy, not atheists evangelists and the right was not so much committed to monarchy and church rule as to economic stability and not rocking the boat.

This is why the "right" can claim the revolutionary forefathers as god fearing saints in a quest to build a Christian theonomy and the "left" can hallucinate a history of religious oppression when neither explanation can stand scrutiny.

Currently I see the archaic and extinct tradition of the principled right and the nearing extinction ACLU loving, pluralist traditional liberal as two viewpoints or application of the same doctrine and the two factions now ascending are both il-liberal (not committed to individual rights or constitutional democracy) and revolutionary (committed to the reformation of culture and society).