Sunday School class on the church and power

[barnhart]

Check out the Edict of Milan for a positive shift in religious tolerance. For a negative example, look at the Church’s power struggles in the medieval period, like the Investiture Controversy.

I'll check it out.

[barnhart]

Lesson 5 will likely shift to the reformation era.

I have a vague memory of reading that Roger Williams was influenced by the radical separation of church and state of the Dutch Annabaptists, but I can't find it. This is for an upcoming class. Does anyone have better google skills than me and can locate it? Bootstrap?

[joshuabgood]

Lesson 5 will likely shift to the reformation era.

I have a vague memory of reading that Roger Williams was influenced by the radical separation of church and state of the Dutch Annabaptists, but I can't find it. This is for an upcoming class. Does anyone have better google skills than me and can locate it? Bootstrap?

Yes he was. It was documented in a book I'll link to in a bit. He was actually literally rebaptized by an English anabaptist. He was also a great friend and protege of the English jurist whose name is skipping me right now...old age.

[joshuabgood]

https://www.amazon.com/Roger-Williams-C ... B007SRVV7O

By Barry. Excellent book.

The jurist who was also Williams benefactor was Sir Edward Coke. He was also formally adopted by Native Americans and given a Native American burial.

[barnhart]

Excellent, so I didn't imagine that. Can you recall offhand any of the details of his interaction with anabaptism beyond his own rebaptism?

[joshuabgood]

Excellent, so I didn't imagine that. Can you recall offhand any of the details of his interaction with anabaptism beyond his own rebaptism?

I'll see if I can get it. Unfortunately I don't own that book...I got it at the library. But I am going back and I'll check it out again.

[Jazman]

Barnhart, hope it's going well. These might be late or inconsequential, but here's a discussion between non-Anabaptists and a quasi?-Anabaptist?
Mike Erre on Holy Post... (Around 38min mark) Interesting points raised about Christians and power...
Also Mike offhand mentions David Fitch, who I believe does claim to be Anabaptist of some sort... maybe some of his material would help? (modern pov/non-Menno background wrestling with the claims/witness of Anabaptism in the world?)

Btw, how is the class going? Is there any possibility that they were recorded or can be reproduced in an audio/video teaching material someday? I would so so like to hear you walk through this stuff. Blessings.

[barnhart]

Barnhart, hope it's going well. These might be late or inconsequential, but here's a discussion between non-Anabaptists and a quasi?-Anabaptist?
Mike Erre on Holy Post... (Around 38min mark) Interesting points raised about Christians and power...
Also Mike offhand mentions David Fitch, who I believe does claim to be Anabaptist of some sort... maybe some of his material would help? (modern pov/non-Menno background wrestling with the claims/witness of Anabaptism in the world?)

Btw, how is the class going? Is there any possibility that they were recorded or can be reproduced in an audio/video teaching material someday? I would so so like to hear you walk through this stuff. Blessings.

Thanks Jazzman, I'll check it out.

The class is going well I think. There was a push after the first session to record it but I resisted. Snapchat may have a point, not everything worth saying needs to be preserved, especially within church life.

I bent the topics for the last two sessions to include back to back critique of ideas and ideologies of power and politics that I see I see confronting the church today. From the right, I used the lust for security and empire as epitomized by Charlemagne and from the left, the misdirection of the Christian impulse to improve or fix society as epitomized by the Western church answering the call to crusade for the relief of the Eastern Church from Muslim rule. Except that I avoided terminology that tracks with modern political divides like right/left, Democrat/Republican, conservative/progressive and substituted neutral terminology like "pitfalls the church falls into when they feel the need to respond to societal ills" and "dangers the church faces when it looks for worldly security."

[Jazman]

Barnhart, hope it's going well. These might be late or inconsequential, but here's a discussion between non-Anabaptists and a quasi?-Anabaptist?
Mike Erre on Holy Post... (Around 38min mark) Interesting points raised about Christians and power...
Also Mike offhand mentions David Fitch, who I believe does claim to be Anabaptist of some sort... maybe some of his material would help? (modern pov/non-Menno background wrestling with the claims/witness of Anabaptism in the world?)

Btw, how is the class going? Is there any possibility that they were recorded or can be reproduced in an audio/video teaching material someday? I would so so like to hear you walk through this stuff. Blessings.

Thanks Jazzman, I'll check it out.

The class is going well I think. There was a push after the first session to record it but I resisted. Snapchat may have a point, not everything worth saying needs to be preserved, especially within church life.

I bent the topics for the last two sessions to include back to back critique of ideas and ideologies of power and politics that I see I see confronting the church today. From the right, I used the lust for security and empire as epitomized by Charlemagne and from the left, the misdirection of the Christian impulse to improve or fix society as epitomized by the Western church answering the call to crusade for the relief of the Eastern Church from Muslim rule. Except that I avoided terminology that tracks with modern political divides like right/left, Democrat/Republican, conservative/progressive and substituted neutral terminology like "pitfalls the church falls into when they feel the need to respond to societal ills" and "dangers the church faces when it looks for worldly security."

Totally understand your choice not to record, etc. I support your line of thinking. But maybe make your outline, notes available? The tact you're taking sounds refreshing and wise. Thanks