High Demand Religions?

[Sudsy]

This has been sad for me to read the way professing brothers and sisters in the Lord treat each other over their differences and practises. If we are going to stand up for the scriptures being our guide to faith and practise, these same scriptures tell us the following - Ephesians 4:1-6-

As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received. Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love. Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace. There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

This text in Eph 4 above reflects the fruit of the Spirit described in Gal 5 - 'The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith, gentleness, and self-control.'

Is this how we are treating each other or has the flesh been given control ? You decide.

[Josh]

This text in Eph 4 above reflects the fruit of the Spirit described in Gal 5 - 'The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith, gentleness, and self-control.'

Is this how we are treating each other or has the flesh been given control ? You decide.

The Bible teaches us to also contend earnestly for sound doctrine, and to mark false teachers and false doctrines.

And yes, Sudsy, teaching things like that it's OK for Christian churches to bless nuclear bombs and bless soldiers' guns and artillery before going out to war is, indeed, false doctrine. There won't be any of that sort of thing in Jesus' kingdom. We should be focused on praying for the lost souls doing these things and seeking to win them over to Christ and to following Jesus' teachings and to be led out of their false churches.

[RZehr]

This has been sad for me to read the way professing brothers and sisters in the Lord treat each other over their differences and practises. If we are going to stand up for the scriptures being our guide to faith and practise, these same scriptures tell us the following - Ephesians 4:1-6-

As a prisoner for the Lord, then, I urge you to live a life worthy of the calling you have received. Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love. Make every effort to keep the unity of the Spirit through the bond of peace. There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

This text in Eph 4 above reflects the fruit of the Spirit described in Gal 5 - 'The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith, gentleness, and self-control.'

Is this how we are treating each other or has the flesh been given control ? You decide.

Time and place. Balance.

Titus 1:9-14

9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.

10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision:

11 Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake.

12 One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, the Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.

13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;

14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

[Sudsy]

This text in Eph 4 above reflects the fruit of the Spirit described in Gal 5 - 'The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faith, gentleness, and self-control.'

Is this how we are treating each other or has the flesh been given control ? You decide.

The Bible teaches us to also contend earnestly for sound doctrine, and to mark false teachers and false doctrines.

And yes, Sudsy, teaching things like that it's OK for Christian churches to bless nuclear bombs and bless soldiers' guns and artillery before going out to war is, indeed, false doctrine. There won't be any of that sort of thing in Jesus' kingdom. We should be focused on praying for the lost souls doing these things and seeking to win them over to Christ and to following Jesus' teachings and to be led out of their false churches.

I'm talking about how this is to be done. I don't think we should ignore how we should stand for what we believe is truth. If we do it under the Spirit's control then the fruit of the Spirit will be obvious and not what scripture calls the acts of the flesh.

If someone tells me that they have a concern for me that I am mis-understanding something and goes on to explain what they believe to be correct in a way that reflects the fruit of the Spirit, then I am more likely to listen to what they have to say. But if they tell me that my views are nonsense or absurd or mindless or stupid, then they put me immediately on the defensive of my understanding.

I believe Christian forums should be a place where the fruit of the Spirit should be obvious in how we talk to other believers and to unbelievers. I know I have failed to keep this in mind at times but I hope if in my future posts they do not reflect the Spirit's fruit, I will be reminded. Of course, in a gentle way.

I would suggest if you desire to pursue this further, that we consider making it, it's own thread.

[seinetsodumm]

I suggest you talk to those more qualified. I spent time on the "Ask about the Orthodox Faith" group and seeking as swers from priests would be better. Look I didn't bring this up, just very upsetting to see it called "heresy" when it is not

The concept of infant baptism being heretical is not new to mennonnet. The very name of Anabaptist (re-baptizer) shows that from its beginning, Anabaptism has not held infant baptism to be a valid expression of faith. Why are you and others so insistent that we as Anabaptist should accept a concept that we and our ancestors have held to be false doctrine for 500 years?

[Judas Maccabeus]

PSA for Ken: In the first 400 years of Christianity, Catholics were persecuted with death sentences by the state. The Early Church Fathers also baptised infants during those centuries as noted in their writings and readings of Scripture (see the link). As a persecuted minority, this was not a political theocratic maneuver to perpetuate a theocracy as Christians had no political power. Rather it was a matter of belief in the graces imparted by the Sacrament of Baptism and an acknowledgement that due to the persecutions and high infant mortality rates, their children may not live to see the age of reason.

Nonsense. For the first 400 years of Christianity there were no Catholics in their current form. There were only Christians who held a wide variety of conflicting views and doctrines. At best, the Roman Catholic church in its current organization form and doctrine draws its origins to the 5th Century.

As for infant baptism? Christianity was still debating infant baptism at the time of Augustine in the late 4th and early 5th centuries. Augustine was an advocate of infant baptism because of his doctrine of original sin. But at that time he was still writing under the presumption that it was not yet settled and universal church doctrine.

The facts in the Early Church Fathers’ writings also disagree with your opinion. If you have an open and scholarly mind, I recommend you do a thorough reading of the writings of the Early Church Fathers. Both Catholic and Orthodox view these early apostles from the first 400 years as authoritative.

If you are not interested in the scholarship of the Early Church Fathers, so be it. This topic has been hashed to death and the ‘us vs them’ mentality is so firmly entrenched that discussion of the documented evidence is no longer productive. Therefore we shall agree to disagree. Done and dusted.

We regard them as being interesting, but by no means authoritative. They, as men can and do err. You seem to be trying to confer some sort of inspiration on things that are not inspired.

[Judas Maccabeus]

PSA for Ken: In the first 400 years of Christianity, Catholics were persecuted with death sentences by the state. The Early Church Fathers also baptised infants during those centuries as noted in their writings and readings of Scripture (see the link). As a persecuted minority, this was not a political theocratic maneuver to perpetuate a theocracy as Christians had no political power. Rather it was a matter of belief in the graces imparted by the Sacrament of Baptism and an acknowledgement that due to the persecutions and high infant mortality rates, their children may not live to see the age of reason.

Nonsense. For the first 400 years of Christianity there were no Catholics in their current form. There were only Christians who held a wide variety of conflicting views and doctrines. At best, the Roman Catholic church in its current organization form and doctrine draws its origins to the 5th Century.

As for infant baptism? Christianity was still debating infant baptism at the time of Augustine in the late 4th and early 5th centuries. Augustine was an advocate of infant baptism because of his doctrine of original sin. But at that time he was still writing under the presumption that it was not yet settled and universal church doctrine.

The facts in the Early Church Fathers’ writings also disagree with your opinion. If you have an open and scholarly mind, I recommend you do a thorough reading of the writings of the Early Church Fathers. Both Catholic and Orthodox view these early apostles from the first 400 years as authoritative.

If you are not interested in the scholarship of the Early Church Fathers, so be it. This topic has been hashed to death and the ‘us vs them’ mentality is so firmly entrenched that discussion of the documented evidence is no longer productive. Therefore we shall agree to disagree. Done and dusted.

Not done until people stop posting heretical positions here. I will remind you this is a Mennonite forum.

[barnhart]

The facts in the Early Church Fathers’ writings also disagree with your opinion. If you have an open and scholarly mind, I recommend you do a thorough reading of the writings of the Early Church Fathers. Both Catholic and Orthodox view these early apostles from the first 400 years as authoritative.

If you are not interested in the scholarship of the Early Church Fathers, so be it. This topic has been hashed to death and the ‘us vs them’ mentality is so firmly entrenched that discussion of the documented evidence is no longer productive. Therefore we shall agree to disagree. Done and dusted.

The early church father's do not agree with themselves about infant baptism.

[ohio jones]

(I am using bold as well in order to assist anyone who is visually impaired.)

Anyone who has legit visual impairment probably already knows how to adjust the display on their device to compensate, and is welcome to ask for help.

Max is well aware that he's shouting, and needs to simmer down.

[MaxPC]

(I am using bold as well in order to assist anyone who is visually impaired.)

Anyone who has legit visual impairment probably already knows how to adjust the display on their device to compensate, and is welcome to ask for help.

Max is well aware that he's shouting, and needs to simmer down.

Picking on the Catholic with vision problems again

ICYMI As I have explained previously, the problem is created with posts that have 3 or more quotes within quotes within quotes. The bold print assists me in following who stated what so that misquotes are avoided. As an experiment try reading through one of those multiple quotes posts on the smallest smart phone screen. You will quickly see enlargement of the print makes it highly difficult to follow the layered quotes.

Of course we have been through this before. ALL CAPS is considered shouting. Forum members bold the print to highlight. Those highlights are helpful to follow the conversation. Perhaps it is time for others to be less sensitive and more accommodating. That is what discipleship in the Christian faith embraces. Or are you just persecuting the Catholic?