A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Christian ethics and theology with an Anabaptist perspective
Josh

Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by Josh »

GoodGirl wrote: ↑Fri Jan 26, 2024 7:14 pm We attended a very conservative Nationwide church for five (?) years. It was actually a conservative subset within Nationwide, called Mennonite Christian Brotherhood.

We are “from the world” (no religious background), and while we were slowly eased into things…
This video really made me realize what my parents must have gone through the first time they visited us, after we had been at the church for a few years.

We left the church… they would never accept us as members, although they did take in our oldest child, a son, and he married a (lovely!) girl there recently, and is currently serving the church in another country.

I have so many memories, good and bad.

To not go deep… one of my weirdest memories was having to hold up the fabric I had bought for dresses in front of a small group of people to be approved or disapproved. All the fabric was well within church standards (in fact, some ladies there already had dresses in the exact same fabric). But they wanted to make sure my husband approved of each one.

Once they suggested I have a dress made “inside out” so the teeny tiny flowers would be on the inside, not the outside, which honestly would have looked dumb~ the inside of the fabric was obviously the inside, you know?

When we finally left, I got rid of some dresses, because to use a worldly term, they were ‘triggering’ and I couldn’t wear them.

The worst they did was try to separate our older children from us, so our children could be raised in “proper” godly homes. I mean, literally they were doing everything they could to prevent me and my oldest daughter from speaking, so they could tell have more control over her life.

She has a lower IQ & I will never forget how the bishop quizzed her & denied her membership because she couldn’t define all the words he used, like ‘sanctification.’
She had taken the time to painstakingly write out her testimony & it was heartbreaking to see how cold he was to her.

To say things got crazy would be kind of an understatement.

There were (and are) some really good people there, but also some who really make me wonder.
GoodGirl,

This is meant as no insult to you, but I can tell you are "opinionated" and like to discuss and figure things out and perhaps even stir up some controversy. Ultra-conservative churches are simply not looking for people like that.

In many situations with seekers, the wife is the one "driving" and the husband follows. This is incompatible with ultra-conservative circles. (It doesn't work that well in my own circles either, but they are more tolerant of such types of marriage dynamics.)

It is also the case that their own members would be subjected to the same kind of rather ridiculous levels of inspection eg of prints/patterns. There are certain boundaries that people who grow up in the culture just "get" and it can be quite mysterious for an outsider to figure out what they are.

You might have found the "less conservative" parts of Nationwide were more pleasant for you, but a lot of seekers don't really like being in a "transitional" setting like that where things are changing and the congregation isn't seeking to try to be strict. On the flip side, it means that you, as a seeker, don't get subjected to these sort of hazing rituals.
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GoodGirl
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Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by GoodGirl »

Josh, believe it or not, I’m not that outspoken in real life. I’m more shy, but this forum is pretty anonymous & introvert friendly, yk? I’d rather type/write my thoughts than try & say them out loud. I hope that makes sense.

I love how you use the word ‘hazing.’ That is the perfect description.

Thanks for your thoughts & comments~ I mean no disrespect or anything negative.
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Robert
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Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by Robert »

The video was good, but only shows the ultra conservative wing. Rosedale , LMC, MCUSA looks a lot different, but are Mennonite also.

Goodgirl, if you are looking a Rosedale Conference(CMC) church might work well for you if you are looking for some conservative aspects without a lot of the legalism.
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Josh

Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by Josh »

GoodGirl wrote: ↑Fri Jan 26, 2024 7:32 pm Josh, believe it or not, I’m not that outspoken in real life. I’m more shy, but this forum is pretty anonymous & introvert friendly, yk? I’d rather type/write my thoughts than try & say them out loud. I hope that makes sense.

I love how you use the word ‘hazing.’ That is the perfect description.

Thanks for your thoughts & comments~ I mean no disrespect or anything negative.
You might think you aren't outspoken in real life, but you're still the same person, and I'm sure your personality "shines through". You might think you're an introvert, but that doesn't mean everyone else thinks you are. (In some of these sorts of ultra conservative cultures, some people rarely speak at all, contrasted to typical American culture where a fair amount of talking can still qualify someone as an "introvert").

So, even if you thought you were trying to be meek and quiet or whatever, they can still "feel" that you are actually a person busy thinking about a lot of things and probably someone who is going to "rock the boat". And there is nothing ultra-conservative groups are looking for less than such a person.

This does leave the question of what, exactly, ultra-conservatives are looking for in a seeker. Mindless automatons? Someone who upon meeting an ultra conservative group, suddenly just believes whatever they say, when prior to that point they have been rejecting most of what the world says? It seems what they are looking for from converts is basically a type of human being that doesn't really exist.
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Robert
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Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by Robert »

Josh wrote: ↑Fri Jan 26, 2024 7:40 pm You might think you aren't outspoken in real life, but you're still the same person, and I'm sure your personality "shines through". You might think you're an introvert, but that doesn't mean everyone else thinks you are. (In some of these sorts of ultra conservative cultures, some people rarely speak at all, contrasted to typical American culture where a fair amount of talking can still qualify someone as an "introvert").
Josh, it is not your place to decide. Speak I statements about yourself. Let each define themself.
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GoodGirl
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Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by GoodGirl »

Ernie, thank you. I know you have seen a lot & understand.
It means a lot.
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GoodGirl
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Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by GoodGirl »

Just in general, once the bishop’s daughter (a married lady in her 40’s) was talking to me, with me crying over not being “allowed” to see my oldest daughter, who was staying in a place for plain girls with issues. (She has medical issues & her medications cause emotional side effects, to kind of over-simplify it.)

Anyway, the bishop’s daughter told me “What they really want to see is that you’re *completely* broken and will do *whatever* they say. Once they see that, they’ll let you join and it won’t be like this anymore.” (Meaning they’d ease up then.)

She had more perspective, having married a man “from the world” who became Mennonite.

That was a very hard time for me, and our whole family.
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Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by GoodGirl »

I’m probably just babbling by now, but we literally moved across the county~ from the west coast to PA~ to have more options in finding a good anabaptist church.

It’s kind of crazy now when I look back on it, and has absolutely nothing to do with the video.

But actually maybe it does… the video shows people who ‘have it together’ with good marriages, well-adjusted children, holy lives… and that’s what we wanted & what we thought we were getting.
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Soloist

Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by Soloist »

GoodGirl wrote: ↑Fri Jan 26, 2024 7:53 pm Anyway, the bishop’s daughter told me “What they really want to see is that you’re *completely* broken and will do *whatever* they say. Once they see that, they’ll let you join and it won’t be like this anymore.” (Meaning they’d ease up then.
When saying “I’ll do whatever you say as long as it doesn’t violate Scripture or my Conscience” and that isn’t acceptable…
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Josh

Re: A YouTuber visits a Nationwide Fellowship church

Post by Josh »

GoodGirl wrote: ↑Fri Jan 26, 2024 7:53 pmAnyway, the bishop’s daughter told me “What they really want to see is that you’re *completely* broken and will do *whatever* they say. Once they see that, they’ll let you join and it won’t be like this anymore.” (Meaning they’d ease up then.)
This seems accurate and is one of the reasons I am not entirely comfortable with ultra-conservative groups. Essentially, the seeker has to basically decide the ultra group is the One True Church, shut their mind off, and just believe whatever the leadership in that group says. I don't think this is a particularly healthy way to think or live, and it doesn't really line up that many people who are seekers are actually nonconformists - they have spent their whole life refusing to be conformed to what the world and its authority figures want, so why would they suddenly do a 180 and just shut their brains off and do whatever their new authority figures tell them?
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