mike wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 7:10 am
Which is irrelevant to the discussion since no Amish or Mennonites try to tax-deduct their school tuition.
No, you're wrong, and that's why I started this discussion.
I'm in a position where I could save a couple of thousand dollars a year by running my tuition payments through the church's offerings. I've asked our deacon about the practice and he admitted it is a "gray area." I've asked my accountant about it, and he said it would be illegal because you can't receive goods or services in exchange for tax-deductible donations.
I’ve never heard of anyone trying to deduct the direct tuition payment. The “gray area” is quite common, but the way i usually see it done is that tuition is very low but members are expected to make sizeable donations - if they are able. Effectively, everyone pays more except people who can’t. But it’s all done by free will.
In my church if the coffers get a bit low for either church or school, the deacons make an announcement and we open up our wallets.
I am a bit puzzled how you would save a few thousand a year… are you in some really high tax bracket? If you’re at 28% and you’re saving $3,000, that means you’re paying $10k a year of tuition?
Soloist wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 8:19 am
In my experience, Mennonite schools tend to be very good education with only homeschooling potentially being better.
As for the tax stuff, not my area of experience, we tend to give and do our utmost for it to be private from any other church member thus we receive no tax recipes or any paperwork. I have misgivings about claiming church funding or such for tax credit and I use the basic credit as Josh suggested so I wouldn’t need it anyway. I don’t judge others who do different, I just don’t want to be making money off of my giving nor have the government fund our church. Again I realize others see this differently.
Not paying a tax is not the “government funding our church”. It just means the government didn’t confiscate quite as much money from you to go and pay for more bombs and wars.
I’ve never heard of anyone trying to deduct the direct tuition payment.
Not only have I heard if this happening but some people attended certain Mennonite churches so they could do this- not all the churches allowed it. School was not for just one church but for many.
I think you are better off staying away from it period. It's a gray area and yes the money isn't going into the coffers of the gov't for more bombs or whatever but this is a place where I feel as believers we need to avoid those gray areas. But that it my opinion.
Here is an article about a Catholic Parish where this subject came up with a local parish school and it was controversial enough to make the local news:
Ken wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 10:05 am
Here is an article about a Catholic Parish where this subject came up with a local parish school and it was controversial enough to make the local news:
Those articles present the debate, the comments from parishioners and the church, and quotes from the law, but they don't give any information about what the resolution was. In other words, just like this discussion. Do you have any idea how it shook out?
Ken wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 10:05 am
Here is an article about a Catholic Parish where this subject came up with a local parish school and it was controversial enough to make the local news:
Those articles present the debate, the comments from parishioners and the church, and quotes from the law, but they don't give any information about what the resolution was. In other words, just like this discussion. Do you have any idea how it shook out?
The article doesn't say.
But then it wouldn't unless the there was an IRS audit of some taxpayer claiming an illegal exemption and the case went to tax court and there was a public record of decision. Otherwise what any individual taxpayer chooses to claim on their own tax return is private information.
0 x
A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Ken wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 10:05 am
Here is an article about a Catholic Parish where this subject came up with a local parish school and it was controversial enough to make the local news:
Those articles present the debate, the comments from parishioners and the church, and quotes from the law, but they don't give any information about what the resolution was. In other words, just like this discussion. Do you have any idea how it shook out?
The article doesn't say.
But then it wouldn't unless the there was an IRS audit of some taxpayer claiming an illegal exemption and the case went to tax court and there was a public record of decision. Otherwise what any individual taxpayer chooses to claim on their own tax return is private information.
And if an individual taking this tax "loophole" gets audited, all they have to do is show their end-of-year statement of donations to their church as evidence. The IRS can't audit winks and nods.
All in all, it basically looks like a matter of conscience and churches respecting the intent of the law. So far, it seems it bothers some and not others. I would like to hear more from people whose churches/schools have thoroughly discussed the issue and decided one way or another, and why.
If there is a tuition, then it is a “gray area” or not legal to deduct. But in our school, the school is not an entity at all. There is no way to pay the school at all. The school has no benefactors at all either. If someone wants to support the school, he can’t. The school is a function of the church, and the only way to support the school, is through the free will offerings to the church. Not a penny is required to attend the school, any more than it costs someone to attend the church service.
While it sounds like there are church schools that do not operate like this, our model is tax deductible. I gave money to the church and supported the school in that way for over ten years before I had children in school, and continue to give to the church, and plan to continue after my children are out of school. Tuition is not part of the conversation at all, either in 1999 nor will it be in 2039.
RZehr wrote: ↑Wed Nov 22, 2023 10:40 am
If there is a tuition, then it is a “gray area” or not legal to deduct. But in our school, the school is not an entity at all. There is no way to pay the school at all. The school has no benefactors at all either. If someone wants to support the school, he can’t. The school is a function of the church, and the only way to support the school, is through the free will offerings to the church. Not a penny is required to attend the school, any more than it costs someone to attend the church service.
While it sounds like there are church schools that do not operate like this, our model is tax deductible. I gave money to the church and supported the school in that way for over ten years before I had children in school, and continue to give to the church, and plan to continue after my children are out of school. Tuition is not part of the conversation at all, either in 1999 nor will it be in 2039.
That makes perfect sense. I assume our school has an EIN and its own checking account.
I’ve never heard of anyone trying to deduct the direct tuition payment.
Not only have I heard if this happening but some people attended certain Mennonite churches so they could do this- not all the churches allowed it. School was not for just one church but for many.
I think you are better off staying away from it period. It's a gray area and yes the money isn't going into the coffers of the gov't for more bombs or whatever but this is a place where I feel as believers we need to avoid those gray areas. But that it my opinion.
That’s not the same as deducting tuition. And yes, a church can support multiple schools are vice versus.
Deducting donations to a church is not a “gray area”.