Global Warning/Climate Change

[Ken]

We have no control over the amount of water vapor in the atmosphere ...

... every ton of CO2 that we spew into the atmosphere causes some additional amount of water to evaporate ...

I am not in the habit of "spewing" CO2 into the atmosphere, but don't these statements seem contradictory?

Well, OK. We don't directly control the amount of water vapor evaporating from the world's oceans and then condensing and returning to earth in the form of precipitation.

But we do indirectly control it by adding other greenhouse gases to the atmosphere like CO2 and methane. I will concede that point.

As for the word "spew"? That is an accurate description of what you do when you drive a car or truck or tractor. The exhaust spews CO2 into the atmosphere. The average car emits between 0.4 and 0.5 kg of CO2 per mile which is about 10 moles of CO2 in chemistry terms. At standard temperature and pressure any gas has a volume of 22.4 liters per mole. So 10 moles of CO2 equates to volume of pure CO2 of about 225 liters which is slightly more than a 55 gallon drum. It would actually be a bit more than that since standard temperature is 0 Celsius. It would actually closer to 65 gallons on a hot summer day, but call it 55 gallons for the sake of visualization.

So every mile you drive you put out another 55 gallon drum of pure CO2, day in and day out. If you are driving at 60 mph that means you are emitting a 55 gallon drum of pure CO2 every minute you drive. And if you drive a big truck SUV, bus, or tractor it is of course much more than that.

Every one of these cars on every highway in the country is putting out a 55 gallon drum of pure CO2 for every mile it drives, day in and day out. If that isn't spewing, I don't know what is.

[temporal1]

Yes he mentioned it and i cant remember why- but when he did i was trying to think back, trying to specifically remember that in the 70s possibly vague memory of what would seem nothing to take too serious at the time as i was a teen.
So you mentioned a blog post, Id like to read it- my pastor doesn't remind me of someone that spends time reading right wing anything- You read this blog post yourself?

Yes i agree we are making Gods Creation worse in an abundance of ways and we should all do better.

But i jave heard fear tactics from global warming alarmist which as a worse case scenario would come across as a threat to mankind-
we just know that this is not how it will play out. Definitely changes were and still are needed.

If i recall, you were a teen in So Cal, unlikely to have been impacted by the frigid extremes of the 60’s-70’s.
i was a bit older, in central Midwest, i promise you, the winters were subzero, with ice+deep snows, frightening, and understood as “worse to be expected.” by 1977, we had our first newborn in January, mainstream TV news, and mainstream printed news were all-in on “The Deep Freeze” reports. Below zero temps for weeks at a time easily “put the fear of God” in you. To repeat, these were considered normal winters.

Holding a completely vulnerable+trusting 7# bundle of joy knowing it’s -20F out, with wind chills -40F or lower, is a deeply humbling experience. If a toddler happens to wander outside, they do not live long.

To this day, every winter that is not exceedingly harsh is appreciated as an exception to be grateful to receive.

i’m not sure if the language used was specifically “global cooling,” but i recall “The Big Freeze” “A second Ice Age,” etc.,
effective language without existence of current cyberspace propaganda tools.

(In addition to my memories, i’ve read) people are more at risk of death via frigid temps than high temps.
Don’t let half-witted ideologues hand-wave your thoughts away. The world is now churning them out, assembly-line fashion.

“Cold weather kills far more people than hot weather”
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 193831.htm

Cold weather kills 20 times as many people as hot weather, according to an international study analyzing over 74 million deaths in 384 locations across 13 countries. The findings also reveal that deaths due to moderately hot or cold weather substantially exceed those resulting from extreme heat waves or cold spells.

This general discussion of the 60’s-70’s harsh frigid weather has come up from time to time earlier in this thread.

As well, we young girls wore skirts/dresses almost exclusively in those years! - in the later 60’s, Twiggy and her minis/micro minis were all the rage! Even formal pants suits were questionable in schools, workplace, churches, for sure. Brrrr.

In So Cal, it might be easy for youngns to not be aware.

Scriptures instruct us to be good stewards of all God’s creation and blessings we experience on earth, including the earth.
That’s a non-issue. Not at all political.

[Valerie]

Yes he mentioned it and i cant remember why- but when he did i was trying to think back, trying to specifically remember that in the 70s possibly vague memory of what would seem nothing to take too serious at the time as i was a teen.
So you mentioned a blog post, Id like to read it- my pastor doesn't remind me of someone that spends time reading right wing anything- You read this blog post yourself?

Yes i agree we are making Gods Creation worse in an abundance of ways and we should all do better.

But i jave heard fear tactics from global warming alarmist which as a worse case scenario would come across as a threat to mankind-
we just know that this is not how it will play out. Definitely changes were and still are needed.

If i recall, you were a teen in So Cal, unlikely to have been impacted by the frigid extremes of the 60’s-70’s.
i was a bit older, in central Midwest, i promise you, the winters were subzero, snowy, frightening, and understood as to be expected.
by 1977, we had our first newborn in January, mainstream TV news, and mainstream printed news were all-in on “The Deep Freeze” reports. Below zero temps for weeks at a time easily “put the fear of God” in you. To repeat, these were considered normal winters.

To this day, every winter that is not exceedingly harsh is appreciated as an exception to be grateful to receive.

i’m not sure if the language used was specifically “global cooling,” but i recall “The Big Freeze” “A second Ice Age,” etc.,
effective language without existence of cyberspace propaganda tools.

(In addition to my memories) i’ve read) people are at risk of death via frigid temps than high temps.
Don’t let half-witted ideologues hand-wave your thoughts away. The world is now churning them out, assembly-line fashion.

“Cold weather kills far more people than hot weather”
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2 ... 193831.htm

Cold weather kills 20 times as many people as hot weather, according to an international study analyzing over 74 million deaths in 384 locations across 13 countries. The findings also reveal that deaths due to moderately hot or cold weather substantially exceed those resulting from extreme heat waves or cold spells.

This general discussion of the 60’s-70’s harsh frigid weather has come up from time to time earlier in this thread.
As well, we young girls wore skirts/dresses almost exclusively in those years! - in the later 60’s, Twiggy and her minis/micro minis was all the rage! Even formal pants suits were questionable in schools, workplace, churches, for sure. Brrrr.

In So Cal, it might be easy for youngns to not be aware.

Scriptures instruct us to be good stewards of all God’s creation and blessings we experience on earth, including the earth.
That’s a non-issue. Not at all political.

Thank you temp, your spot on- that's why when I was racking my brain and pastor said that about the '70s they were saying we were headed for ice age, it was the vague memory and sure as a person growing up in Southern California that wouldn't have seemed like a real threat I could see where it would be to someone already dealing with those frigid temperatures. God is sovereign over our weather! He seems to want to remind us.

Funny you mention Twiggy (my nickname for awhile, funny memory. It was a homosexual designer who invented the pants suit for women. We can see how the enemy of our soul was weaving himself in various ways through the minds and hearts of people trying to recreate mankind and their image. Funny how we were not allowed to wear pants to school you weren't no matter how cold it was. Why weren't we allowed to wear pants?

[temporal1]

.. Why weren't we allowed to wear pants?

i believe it goes back to some other discussions about how “plain” dress originally wasn’t nearly as distinctive as it’s become over time. Girls wearing pants was unheard of, there were dress codes in public schools.

i remember woolen leggings (not the form-fitting spandex creations common today, there was no spandex)!
we didn’t often have them, too expensive for our big family, even with hand-me-downs. we didn’t always have boots, when we did, they were likely uninsulated rain boots!! not much help.

once at school or church, these winter leggings would be removed and left with coats. they weren’t for inside.
it wasn’t unusual for heavy woven wool leggings to be worn over boys’ pants, and, of course, multiple layers of socks (if you had them).

it could be hard to walk/manuever, once all bundled up! if a toddler fell over, he/she probably couldn’t get up, but would have to be “put back up” again.

i heard from some, there were felt liners that could be bought for rain boots. i wasn’t aware in those years.
we scampered to get inside, i promise you that much!!

[MaxPC]

Back in the 1970s the scientists predicted a doomsday from global cooling a new ice age.

Indeed. This is a matter, like all matters, in which God is in control. Science is driven by politics and seems to be more each decade. There have always been political variables within the scientific community; always.

Whether for money, fame, honors, or all of the above, personal ambitions mixed with politics will be involved. There are precious few “pure scientists” who seek knowledge for the sake of knowledge. Hence the inherent flaw of making idols of “science” and “scientists”. It is, quite truthfully, another form of idolatry. God is and always will be in control.

Having been a part of the scientific community for a significant portion of my life, I can honestly share that the pressures to publish; the pressures of funding so that one can have data to publish; the temptations to receive corporate pocket money; the self-interested personal investments in companies (e.g. pharmaceuticals stock options); all taint and bias data and forgo honest scientific method.

[Ken]

Back in the 1970s the scientists predicted a doomsday from global cooling a new ice age.

Indeed. This is a matter, like all matters, in which God is in control. Science is driven by politics and seems to be more each decade. There have always been political variables within the scientific community; always.

Whether for money, fame, honors, or all of the above, personal ambitions mixed with politics will be involved. There are precious few “pure scientists” who seek knowledge for the sake of knowledge. Hence the inherent flaw of making idols of “science” and “scientists”. It is, quite truthfully, another form of idolatry. God is and always will be in control.

Having been a part of the scientific community for a significant portion of my life, I can honestly share that the pressures to publish; the pressures of funding so that one can have data to publish; the temptations to receive corporate pocket money; the self-interested personal investments in companies (e.g. pharmaceuticals stock options); all taint and bias data and forgo honest scientific method.

So I am curious.

You are constantly posting on other topics as if you think human actions, politics and policy matters greatly. And that the choices that people and politicians make have consequences here on earth. For example, you seem to be obsessed with tracking the crime blotter in various west coast cities under the assumption that the actions people take and the policies that politicians implement have real world consequences. That actions and policies matter greatly.

But when it comes to the environment you seem to take the opposite tack and argue that human actions and policies do not matter because "God is in Control." That it doesn't matter what we do to the environment. That policies inconsequential.

This seems like an utterly inconsistent position to take. To argue that what happens to San Francisco is the direct result of human choices and policies, but what happens to the Colorado River or Mississippi River Delta or Everglades is not.

[MaxPC]

Per usual, Ken misinterprets, misconstrues and attacks others who hold a different view than his own sense of infallibility. Hence another round on the ban bench. Ken does not know how to respect other viewpoints and continues to malign those held by others by twisting narratives. These are not the actions of a civil individual. Dust shaken.

[JimFoxvog]

Per usual, Ken misinterprets, misconstrues and attacks others who hold a different view than his own sense of infallibility. Hence another round on the ban bench. Ken does not know how to respect other viewpoints and continues to malign those held by others by twisting narratives. These are not the actions of a civil individual. Dust shaken.

Although I wouldn't express it the same way, I had the same reaction as Ken. Why does "God is in control" seem to serve to dismiss environmental concerns, but not social? Please clarify if that's not what you are doing with the "God is in control" comment.

[Josh]

Per usual, Ken misinterprets, misconstrues and attacks others who hold a different view than his own sense of infallibility. Hence another round on the ban bench. Ken does not know how to respect other viewpoints and continues to malign those held by others by twisting narratives. These are not the actions of a civil individual. Dust shaken.

Although I wouldn't express it the same way, I had the same reaction as Ken. Why does "God is in control" seem to serve to dismiss environmental concerns, but not social? Please clarify if that's not what you are doing with the "God is in control" comment.

People can’t control the weather, but we can control actions like whether we chose to commit a crime or not.

[Valerie]

Per usual, Ken misinterprets, misconstrues and attacks others who hold a different view than his own sense of infallibility. Hence another round on the ban bench. Ken does not know how to respect other viewpoints and continues to malign those held by others by twisting narratives. These are not the actions of a civil individual. Dust shaken.

Although I wouldn't express it the same way, I had the same reaction as Ken. Why does "God is in control" seem to serve to dismiss environmental concerns, but not social? Please clarify if that's not what you are doing with the "God is in control" comment.

People can’t control the weather, but we can control actions like whether we chose to commit a crime or not.

I think many of us would like to remind people that God is sovereign over the weather. I'm continually saying that to customers at work pretend to be grumblers and get them to be thankful, look for the good in the weather. Because it is God who is in control of the weather.

People hurt the environment-.

Global warming which has changed to Climate Change seems political, and agenda motivated and lacks recognition of weather patterns

I do believe God is allowing us to suffer the consequences of greed which if that has caused our environment to affect the climate then we are separating the consequences for that. He is still in control of the weather he does not take a back seat to this agenda