Excessive violence in schools

[Ken]

Where did I do that?

You are giving voice to the same arguments used across the country to justify every form of segregation. It is un-Christian. We can be better than that.

You are putting words in my mouth. I never said such a thing, and in fact, I think Sliceitup doesn’t understand the nature of the problem because she has only experienced a cozy, segregated school.

I said the school district should be making sure students are not subject to racialised violence. The school district told the parents to go enrol somewhere else. Sounds like the school district is the one promoting segregation: “go enrol in a school with people your own race, and go away”

I will continue to promote private, Christian schools. That is not “segregation”. I have never promoted a school that only allowed pupils of a certain race. The majority of my time volunteering and donations were with a school where my race was in the minority.

"racialized violence" is itself a prejudicial term. Even a cursory look at national data on school violence will tell you that youth violence and bullying occurs consistently across all races and ethnicities. All white rural schools actually have higher rates of bullying and violence than diverse suburban schools.

And you even slightly scratch the history of school segregation since Brown v. Board of Education in 1954 you will find that white Christian schools were the universal and favorite tool of white segregationists across the south, and still are.

[Josh]

Whoa, Ken. Are you telling me that violence is consistent between different racial groups with no racial disparities?

[Ken]

Whoa, Ken. Are you telling me that violence is consistent between different racial groups with no racial disparities?

Way upstream in this thread I provided you with a wealth of actual data on school violence and youth violence in this country. I suggest you study it. You came here with one single anecdotal example of an incident caught on cell phone in Miami.

My point is that you can make a positive and affirmative argument in favor of Christian schools. Many do. And that is fine and good. I actually support such schools.

Or you can make the negative racist argument that segregationists have been making for 60 years. That Christian schools are a way to get your children out of racially diverse public schools. By harping on “racialized violence” that is what you are doing.

It is your choice. Words matter and arguments matter.

[Only an Anz]

The parents sought help before this happened; the New York Post reports:



So the answer from the school seems to be “You aren’t welcome here”, go elsewhere, and when they didn’t, their children were savagely beaten.

I keep looking for more detailed articles about this story and I’m not having any luck finding one. As reported, it sounds like an atrocious situation. And doesn’t vibe with the experiences I’ve had with public schools and fights.

Have you ever lived in a disadvantaged, non-majority-white area and sent your young children to public school?

Desegregation was a major factor for private schools' ascendency in the 1960's. Do you have anything new to say?

[Josh]

I keep looking for more detailed articles about this story and I’m not having any luck finding one. As reported, it sounds like an atrocious situation. And doesn’t vibe with the experiences I’ve had with public schools and fights.

Have you ever lived in a disadvantaged, non-majority-white area and sent your young children to public school?

Desegregation was a major factor for private schools' ascendency in the 1960's. Do you have anything new to say?

What does they have to do with anything? It’s 2033, not 1960.

In this case, a family tried to go to their local, desegregated school. Their children were targeted for violence. The school administration told them to go to another school when they asked for help.

My position from the beginning was that all children should be free of being targeted for violence. In particular, a 9 year old girl should not be beaten by multiple 14 year old males twice her size. And the school district’s response shouldn’t be, “go find a segregated school if you don’t want your kids to be beaten up”.

[Ken]

Have you ever lived in a disadvantaged, non-majority-white area and sent your young children to public school?

Desegregation was a major factor for private schools' ascendency in the 1960's. Do you have anything new to say?

What does they have to do with anything? It’s 2033, not 1960.

In this case, a family tried to go to their local, desegregated school. Their children were targeted for violence. The school administration told them to go to another school when they asked for help.

My position from the beginning was that all children should be free of being targeted for violence. In particular, a 9 year old girl should not be beaten by multiple 14 year old males twice her size. And the school district’s response shouldn’t be, “go find a segregated school if you don’t want your kids to be beaten up”.

We are a nation of 330,000 million people and you keep coming back to one single incident in Miami and citing 2nd and 3rd hand reporting from the New York Post which is a notorious sensationalist rag 10 states away who's stock in trade is finding lurid headlines. Maybe they reported everything accurately, maybe they didn't. But there hasn't been any follow-up reporting so we don't know.

And in any event, one anecdote doesn't even make a trend as I pointed out to you with the anecdotes of sexual abuse in the Holdeman Church.

If we actually take a step back and take a broader look at the issue of school violence and school safety then the issue becomes much more complex. If you actually look at the data it becomes clear that the two things that correlate most closely with school violence are poverty and access to weapons. Not race. If we want to talk about REAL school violence that actually kills and wounds children then we find that most school shooters are actually white and most schools where school shootings happen are rural and suburban, not highly diverse urban schools.

The argument that public schools are uniquely dangerous because of what you call "racialized violence" is simply false. It is, however, the same argument that racists have been making for decades in favor or segregated private schools. Back in the past it was fears that your White daughter might find a Black boyfriend. Today it is "racialized violence" Which is fanned by the occasional lurid story that gets picked up by papers like the New York Post or Fox News. But it is the same argument they have always been making.

Does that mean that school violence between kids of different races does not occur? Whether motivated by race or other more mundane reasons? Of course not. But it does not mean the problem of violence in our schools is primarily a racial problem. It is not.

[temporal1]

What does they have to do with anything? It’s 2033 [2023], not 1960.

In this case, a family tried to go to their local, desegregated school. Their children were targeted for violence. The school administration told them to go to another school when they asked for help.

My position from the beginning was that all children should be free of being targeted for violence. In particular, a 9 year old girl should not be beaten by multiple 14 year old males twice her size. And the school district’s response shouldn’t be, “go find a segregated school if you don’t want your kids to be beaten up”.

It’s too bad your valid topic has been taken off onto so many distractions.

Babies are not born civilized, God entrusts them to parents, churches, and communities to socialize them; for humans, a lengthy endeavor of years+years. Hopefully, a labor of love.

Impulse control is very important, a mark of civility, maturity, a requirement of family and community life. Lessons begin at toddler years. The video is a wretched example of FAILURE. Unfortunately, it’s not uncommon.

Even in my very good culturally mixed public school decades ago, “excessive violence” happened in school, on playgrounds, on busses, altho the vast majority walked. Mostly boys, all descriptions, not 100%. i had a lead-pencil mark on my hand for many years where another student stabbed me! It was scary. i can’t recall who did it. i’m thinking it was a boy? i’m thinking, when he saw what he did, he withdrew in shame, i think he was sorry. he said nothing. neither did i. i think it was a random impulse. [it was a weird.]

He didn’t keep stabbing and stabbing. This was in our elementary classroom. i didn’t tell anyone. i think we were both shocked.

Removing firearms, segregation, etc., this is a great topic: socializing children. Starting with toddlers.
The video was horrible, the boy needs serious attention. Parents are responsible for preparing their little darlings to be READY to attend school.

School is best seen as a privilege to be earned, partly by basic civilized behavior first taught in homes.

As for segregation today - much has reversed.
Today’s reports are of blacks wanting/demanding segregation, “no whites wanted.”
i first began to read about this maybe 20 years ago. It hasn’t gone away. (It was always there!) More public now.
Young black people are proud and don’t want to be bothered with white people.

Old tropes die hard.

[temporal1]

i’ve read, because of local high crime rates, inner city schools are better prepared to PREVENT gun violence on school grounds,
thus “most school shooters are white.”

this seems entirely plausible. taking practical measures of prevention is not magic.

[Josh]

I fail to see how gun control does anything about fists.

[temporal1]

I fail to see how gun control does anything about fists.

i agree, off topic. but a #1 lib talking point, “good for all occasions.”
The FIRST response to your OP. Carry that water!

.. note to self:
remember to request responses be aimed at-the-OP for the first 4 pages or so ..