Elon Musk. Twitter. Babylon Bee.

[mike]

Last 12 months:

Dow -9%
Nasdaq -33%
S&P 500 -19%

TSLA -68%

Bad for everybody's retirement and investment funds

[Ken]

Last 12 months:

Dow -9%
Nasdaq -33%
S&P 500 -19%

The normal definition of a "Bear Market" is when stocks are 20% or more off their previous high.

Nasdaq is tech-heavy which is probably why it has done worse in 2022. Tech stocks shot way up to nose-bleed levels during the pandemic and some of that air is getting let out now that people realize that the new world isn't going to be endless hiding out in our houses using Zoom, Amazon, Facebook, and DoorDash.

[mike]

Last 12 months:

Dow -9%
Nasdaq -33%
S&P 500 -19%

The normal definition of a "Bear Market" is when stocks are 20% or more off their previous high.

Nasdaq is tech-heavy which is probably why it has done worse in 2022. Tech stocks shot way up to nose-bleed levels during the pandemic and some of that air is getting let out now that people realize that the new world isn't going to be endless hiding out in our houses using Zoom, Amazon, Facebook, and DoorDash.

Or driving around in electric cars, apparently.

[Ken]

Last 12 months:

Dow -9%
Nasdaq -33%
S&P 500 -19%

The normal definition of a "Bear Market" is when stocks are 20% or more off their previous high.

Nasdaq is tech-heavy which is probably why it has done worse in 2022. Tech stocks shot way up to nose-bleed levels during the pandemic and some of that air is getting let out now that people realize that the new world isn't going to be endless hiding out in our houses using Zoom, Amazon, Facebook, and DoorDash.

Or driving around in electric cars, apparently.

10 years ago there were only about 3 EVs on the market. Tesla, Nissan Leaf, and Chevy Bolt. Today there are over 50. Tesla was clearly superior when the competition was only the Nissan Leaf and Bolt. Today not so much. And the future? We are in a world market, not a US market for automobiles. Countries like China and India and the EU are going to drive EV markets as much or more than the US.

[mike]

The normal definition of a "Bear Market" is when stocks are 20% or more off their previous high.

Nasdaq is tech-heavy which is probably why it has done worse in 2022. Tech stocks shot way up to nose-bleed levels during the pandemic and some of that air is getting let out now that people realize that the new world isn't going to be endless hiding out in our houses using Zoom, Amazon, Facebook, and DoorDash.

Or driving around in electric cars, apparently.

10 years ago there were only about 3 EVs on the market. Tesla, Nissan Leaf, and Chevy Bolt. Today there are over 50. Tesla was clearly superior when the competition was only the Nissan Leaf and Bolt. Today not so much. And the future? We are in a world market, not a US market for automobiles. Countries like China and India and the EU are going to drive EV markets as much or more than the US.

One of Tesla's biggest problems is their dealer and service network. The traditional car companies have dealerships and service centers everywhere. Tesla can't compete with that, no matter how good their cars are. I'm not buying one if I have to drive 2 hours to get service done.

[Ken]

Or driving around in electric cars, apparently.

10 years ago there were only about 3 EVs on the market. Tesla, Nissan Leaf, and Chevy Bolt. Today there are over 50. Tesla was clearly superior when the competition was only the Nissan Leaf and Bolt. Today not so much. And the future? We are in a world market, not a US market for automobiles. Countries like China and India and the EU are going to drive EV markets as much or more than the US.

One of Tesla's biggest problems is their dealer and service network. The traditional car companies have dealerships and service centers everywhere. Tesla can't compete with that, no matter how good their cars are. I'm not buying one if I have to drive 2 hours to get service done.

Yep. Plus you absolutely cannot just take it to your friendly independent neighborhood EV mechanic like you can with a Toyota or VW since everything is software based and tightly controlled.

One of the ways that the EV market needs to catch up is in the area of "right to repair" so that you can get your EVs serviced at any local qualified mechanic. That isn't possible today. Something that Congress should absolutely address. It is a huge issue with big trucks and farm equipment. But will be a growing issue with EVs as well.

[mike]

Plus you absolutely cannot just take it to your friendly independent neighborhood EV mechanic like you can with a Toyota or VW since everything is software based.

If it's just a software issue, Tesla can often fix them with an over the air update. They are still called "safety recalls." I'd be more worried about weird electrical or battery issues. There's also the thing to consider that they don't need normal drivetrain maintenance. Tires, brakes, and wipers. So I should just say, I wouldn't want to depend on one as my primary vehicle if I couldn't get local service. Teslas are mighty nice vehicles.

The other complete unknown is the lifespan of some of these EVs and their resale value once they need replacement batteries. I'm sure somebody will figure out how to keep from having to throw them away when the body is still good but the battery is bad, and the value of the car is less than the replacement battery. But it's a real question. My father in law had a Toyota Corolla hybrid where the battery was basically shot, and the puny gas engine wasn't much better. It was all but a pile of junk even though the body wasn't bad.

[Ken]

Plus you absolutely cannot just take it to your friendly independent neighborhood EV mechanic like you can with a Toyota or VW since everything is software based.

If it's just a software issue, Tesla can often fix them with an over the air update. They are still called "safety recalls." I'd be more worried about weird electrical or battery issues. There's also the thing to consider that they don't need normal drivetrain maintenance. Tires, brakes, and wipers. So I should just say, I wouldn't want to depend on one as my primary vehicle if I couldn't get local service. Teslas are mighty nice vehicles.

The other complete unknown is the lifespan of some of these EVs and their resale value once they need replacement batteries. I'm sure somebody will figure out how to keep from having to throw them away when the body is still good but the battery is bad, and the value of the car is less than the replacement battery. But it's a real question. My father in law had a Toyota Corolla hybrid where the battery was basically shot, and the puny gas engine wasn't much better. It was all but a pile of junk even though the body wasn't bad.

The problem with EVs is that mechanical problems are software problems and vice versa. For example, say you have a charging problem with your Tesla. Is that a mechanical problem with the wiring and battery? Or a software problem? Or maybe the car isn't heating or defrosting properly. Is that a software glitch or a mechanical issue? Even just diagnosing it will likely require proprietary access into the computer system that an independent mechanic will not have.

Sure you can probably do things like replace brake pads and tires. Or fix dents and scratches. But beyond that, most mechanical issues will require software analysis and vice versa.

[Ken]

Plus you absolutely cannot just take it to your friendly independent neighborhood EV mechanic like you can with a Toyota or VW since everything is software based.

If it's just a software issue, Tesla can often fix them with an over the air update. They are still called "safety recalls." I'd be more worried about weird electrical or battery issues. There's also the thing to consider that they don't need normal drivetrain maintenance. Tires, brakes, and wipers. So I should just say, I wouldn't want to depend on one as my primary vehicle if I couldn't get local service. Teslas are mighty nice vehicles.

The other complete unknown is the lifespan of some of these EVs and their resale value once they need replacement batteries. I'm sure somebody will figure out how to keep from having to throw them away when the body is still good but the battery is bad, and the value of the car is less than the replacement battery. But it's a real question. My father in law had a Toyota Corolla hybrid where the battery was basically shot, and the puny gas engine wasn't much better. It was all but a pile of junk even though the body wasn't bad.

In the future a lot of smaller EV companies are likely to use the same interchangeable batteries. So that should make things easier. As of today you can't put a Tesla battery in a Nissan or vice versa. I expect that will eventually change to where you can get generic replacement batteries anywhere. Or better yet, they have replaceable cells that can just be swapped out for any generic replacement that you can buy at your local AutoZone.

[Sliceitup]

Or driving around in electric cars, apparently.

10 years ago there were only about 3 EVs on the market. Tesla, Nissan Leaf, and Chevy Bolt. Today there are over 50. Tesla was clearly superior when the competition was only the Nissan Leaf and Bolt. Today not so much. And the future? We are in a world market, not a US market for automobiles. Countries like China and India and the EU are going to drive EV markets as much or more than the US.

One of Tesla's biggest problems is their dealer and service network. The traditional car companies have dealerships and service centers everywhere. Tesla can't compete with that, no matter how good their cars are. I'm not buying one if I have to drive 2 hours to get service done.

I have heard rumblings that more manufacturers may go to the ‘straight to customer’ method without the dealership middleman.