What they wore

[Judas Maccabeus]

Would most KMF churches also investigate and go through the ‘reconciliation process’ before deciding if reporting is warranted? Or is that just a few churches who partnered with a specific Mid Atlantic church?

The policy in place is that you will report, when an allegation is made. Why people go to the ministry to report a crime is beyond me. The rules we are required to follow are quite explicit, and must be reviewed periodically. Our version of it mandates canceling Sunday school when there wil not be at least two students in a class. All the doors have large windows, the SS superintendent random visits each class daily, our VBS is done outdoors and there is almost 100 % video recorder coverage due to the presence of the school. Our bishop that did the training very clearly stated if such an allegation is made, you will report it, and let the authorities investigate.

How much more can we do?

Judas Maccabeus

I’m in agreement that reporting a crime to the ministry isn’t the way to handle it. The photos I have attached are papers that were handed out to at least one KMF church and it is written in a way that would imply it was the policy for the KMF and Mid Atlantic conferences. The following lines are what I find particularly problematic, because I don’t see how following the redemptive process is something that needs to be done before the legal process. Not to mention the fact that church leadership is very rarely qualified to investigate such matters.

We are concerned about the mandatory reporting requirements because it demands a report out to the state before the redemptive process outlined in scripture can be followed. We desire our churches to be places of redemption, reconcillation, and healing where anyone who is obstinate, proud or angry would change to a loving caregiver by submitting to the lord and his church. in the event that one of our members would not heed the redemptive process of the church they would be excommunicated and turned over to the state for investigation and punishment. We are not resisting the concept of reporting out where needed, we are
appealing for space for the church to work through a redemptive process bringing the person to healing and
wholeness before having to report them out to the state.

What you have scanned is an account of preliminary discussion and it did not represent final policy. I have seen this letter before. You seem to have a relationship with a KMF church, so get a copy of the book "Child Protection and Safety Concerns" from your ministry, they will happily give you a copy. Read chapter 6, beginning on page 29. This book was published by the EPMC I am aware that some of the things unique to PA do not apply to us. Maryland does not have some of the laws in place that were brought about due to the Penn State incident.

One of our primary concerns is that in the event the state determines it must remove a child from a home, that they be placed with another family of like faith and practice, preferable a relative. (Page 32)

I will not even pretend that all decisions that have been made in this area have been perfect, but at least we are trying. The process of redemption and restoration may need be carried out in parallel with the process dictated by the laws of the state. Caesar has the right to punish wrongdoers, and we have the right to work towards repentance, reconciliation and restoration.

Blessings, and I hope all works out well between you and your church. KMF is not perfect, but it works far better than others that I have seen.

Judas Maccabeus

[Judas Maccabeus]

We try to comply with all relevant Maryland regulations. I don’t really deal with stuff in Pennsylvania, but the general feeling in KMF is that we do our best to comply. We use the guidelines from the EPMC, as do other churches. Obviously, we do not feel the need in Maryland to comply with PA’s regulations. My info was sent into the state, but only because I am teaching middle school half time.

York left KMF last year, so I don’t get up there much.

Judas Maccabeus

Nice to see you posting again, JM

Retired from Nuclear Medicine, left the lab about 2 years ago. As to posting, likely I won't be doing much of it. I just do not have time. I am getting ready for the first time my school has ever used a new science curriculum, and it is earth science. Life science I know cold, Physical science likewise, but I never had earth science in college. I am also teaching social studies, and there is no christian civics book that reflects our views, so I am working through a textbook that the Seventh Day Adventists use. It is secular, but not offensive. One of the ones we used was "Our Christian Heritage" for American government, please give me a break.

I hope the heat over the COVID/Political stuff has died down. I still am concerned about the reach of conspiracy theories among our people.

Judas Maccabeus

[Ken]

We try to comply with all relevant Maryland regulations. I don’t really deal with stuff in Pennsylvania, but the general feeling in KMF is that we do our best to comply. We use the guidelines from the EPMC, as do other churches. Obviously, we do not feel the need in Maryland to comply with PA’s regulations. My info was sent into the state, but only because I am teaching middle school half time.

York left KMF last year, so I don’t get up there much.

Judas Maccabeus

Nice to see you posting again, JM

Retired from Nuclear Medicine, left the lab about 2 years ago. As to posting, likely I won't be doing much of it. I just do not have time. I am getting ready for the first time my school has ever used a new science curriculum, and it is earth science. Life science I know cold, Physical science likewise, but I never had earth science in college. I am also teaching social studies, and there is no christian civics book that reflects our views, so I am working through a textbook that the Seventh Day Adventists use. It is secular, but not offensive. One of the ones we used was "Our Christian Heritage" for American government, please give me a break.

I hope the heat over the COVID/Political stuff has died down. I still am concerned about the reach of conspiracy theories among our people.

Judas Maccabeus

Here is an online earth science curriculum that has a lot of turn-key online labs and activities if you need any supplements from what you already have. There are separate student and teacher web sites. It is all free. I recently incorporated the Ocean Acidification material into my chemistry classes at the end of the year to give them something different to do than another chapter in their regular chemistry textbook.

https://serc.carleton.edu/earthlabs/index.html

[steve-in-kville]

Would most KMF churches also investigate and go through the ‘reconciliation process’ before deciding if reporting is warranted? Or is that just a few churches who partnered with a specific Mid Atlantic church?

Not trying to be a buzz-kill but failing to report abuse comes with legal consequences. The county and the police don't care about whatever "reconciliation process" your church has in place.

[Sliceitup]

Would most KMF churches also investigate and go through the ‘reconciliation process’ before deciding if reporting is warranted? Or is that just a few churches who partnered with a specific Mid Atlantic church?

Not trying to be a buzz-kill but failing to report abuse comes with legal consequences. The county and the police don't care about whatever "reconciliation process" your church has in place.

I have no disagreement with you. I think it was an extraordinarily dumb policy.

[Josh]

Would most KMF churches also investigate and go through the ‘reconciliation process’ before deciding if reporting is warranted? Or is that just a few churches who partnered with a specific Mid Atlantic church?

Not trying to be a buzz-kill but failing to report abuse comes with legal consequences. The county and the police don't care about whatever "reconciliation process" your church has in place.

God does, and we should obey God rather than men.

We also have religious freedom in this country. Police and counties don’t rule as absolute despots. PA’s law is particularly bad, although also very difficult to enforce.

If I felt I was in PA and someone reported abuse to me, the first person I would contact is a lawyer, not the police. (We still have rights to have a lawyer in America too.)

[Josh]

Would most KMF churches also investigate and go through the ‘reconciliation process’ before deciding if reporting is warranted? Or is that just a few churches who partnered with a specific Mid Atlantic church?

Not trying to be a buzz-kill but failing to report abuse comes with legal consequences. The county and the police don't care about whatever "reconciliation process" your church has in place.

I have no disagreement with you. I think it was an extraordinarily dumb policy.

So, you think obeying the Bible is a “dumb policy”?

[mike]

Not trying to be a buzz-kill but failing to report abuse comes with legal consequences. The county and the police don't care about whatever "reconciliation process" your church has in place.

I have no disagreement with you. I think it was an extraordinarily dumb policy.

So, you think obeying the Bible is a “dumb policy”?

There is no biblical command that a reconciliation process must precede the process that the law requires. If an abuser is reported and immediately arrested and imprisoned, there is no reason that "reconciliation" cannot still happen. In an example I am very familiar with, a man's wife and/or his pastor immediately reported him to the police for the abuse as soon as it was discovered, and he was arrested within the hour. This does not mean the church could not have pursued a "reconciliation policy" had it wanted to do so.

[Szdfan]

I have no disagreement with you. I think it was an extraordinarily dumb policy.

So, you think obeying the Bible is a “dumb policy”?

There is no biblical command that a reconciliation process must precede the process that the law requires. If an abuser is reported and immediately arrested and imprisoned, there is no reason that "reconciliation" cannot still happen. In an example I am very familiar with, a man's wife and/or his pastor immediately reported him to the police for the abuse as soon as it was discovered, and he was arrested within the hour. This does not mean the church could not have pursued a "reconciliation policy" had it wanted to do so.

The role of the church isn’t investigative. It’s not the church’s role to investigate claims, decide who is guilty and dole out punishment. That’s the role of law enforcement. Churches frequently have no idea what they’re doing and often cause more harm by stepping into law enforcement’s role.

The role of the church is pastoral — to both the survivor and the perpetrator.

[RZehr]

So, you think obeying the Bible is a “dumb policy”?

There is no biblical command that a reconciliation process must precede the process that the law requires. If an abuser is reported and immediately arrested and imprisoned, there is no reason that "reconciliation" cannot still happen. In an example I am very familiar with, a man's wife and/or his pastor immediately reported him to the police for the abuse as soon as it was discovered, and he was arrested within the hour. This does not mean the church could not have pursued a "reconciliation policy" had it wanted to do so.

The role of the church isn’t investigative. It’s not the church’s role to investigate claims, decide who is guilty and dole out punishment. That’s the role of law enforcement. Churches frequently have no idea what they’re doing and often cause more harm by stepping into law enforcement’s role.

The role of the church is pastoral — to both the survivor and the perpetrator.

I agree. But if reporting is required, I don’t see that as unbearable. Difficult, unwieldy, sure. Wrong, no.