Ministering to People With Unwanted Pregnancies

[justme]

Justme, I'm actually referencing a woman actually engaging in sexual activity and then saying no in mid stride. She has responsibility for her choices. Yes, the man who continues is sinning but the woman is to blame as well.

Either way, this is derailing the subject and I'm stopping doing so.

and i as well don't want to go down this trail too far. after all, most of you are male, and i am female, and i've come to the place where i don't want to discuss too far these subjects.

i agree, she has responsibility for her choices. that is why she had decided this is as far as i'm going. no more, i don't want any more. i'm done, i've said no. she has taken responsibility for as far as she is willing to go.

if the man has no self control at that point in time? does that mean that there is a point in time that a man becomes nothing better than the lion in your analogy who is only working on instinct?

[Ken]

Justme, I'm actually referencing a woman actually engaging in sexual activity and then saying no in mid stride. She has responsibility for her choices. Yes, the man who continues is sinning but the woman is to blame as well.

I would venture to guess that an infinitesimally small percentage of rapes and an even smaller percentage of abortions are the result of women who changed their minds about it mid-intercourse.

[AnthonyMartin]

Our Chair of OB/GYN services had been looking for residential assistance for single mothers who were hesitant to abort but felt trapped. I wonder if any attempt has ever been made for that type of ministry to single mothers with unwanted pregnancy?

It seems to me that the hospitality and homemaking gifts many Mennonites have would set us up to be leaders in this type of ministry.

I’m much more interested in folks taking responsibility for the consequences of their choices moving forward than I’m assigning blame for past sins…

[barnhart]

Our Chair of OB/GYN services had been looking for residential assistance for single mothers who were hesitant to abort but felt trapped. I wonder if any attempt has ever been made for that type of ministry to single mothers with unwanted pregnancy?

It seems to me that the hospitality and homemaking gifts many Mennonites have would set us up to be leaders in this type of ministry.

I’m much more interested in folks taking responsibility for the consequences of their choices moving forward than I’m assigning blame for past sins…

I find this exciting. I have been praying for years for a similar type of contact with abortion providers in my area. Since I am a furniture builder I have dreamed of being asked to make office furniture and reception desks for such a facility just to learn to know the directors.

[steve-in-kville]

Our Chair of OB/GYN services had been looking for residential assistance for single mothers who were hesitant to abort but felt trapped. I wonder if any attempt has ever been made for that type of ministry to single mothers with unwanted pregnancy?

It seems to me that the hospitality and homemaking gifts many Mennonites have would set us up to be leaders in this type of ministry.

I’m much more interested in folks taking responsibility for the consequences of their choices moving forward than I’m assigning blame for past sins…

I haven't been participating in these threads but Anthony's reply brings up a valid point: are we too judgmental as an Anabaptist community that we ignore this need? Too often I hear "she brought it onto herself" or "that's what you get" instead of, "how can we help?".

[AnthonyMartin]

Our Chair of OB/GYN services had been looking for residential assistance for single mothers who were hesitant to abort but felt trapped. I wonder if any attempt has ever been made for that type of ministry to single mothers with unwanted pregnancy?

It seems to me that the hospitality and homemaking gifts many Mennonites have would set us up to be leaders in this type of ministry.

I’m much more interested in folks taking responsibility for the consequences of their choices moving forward than I’m assigning blame for past sins…

I haven't been participating in these threads but Anthony's reply brings up a valid point: are we too judgmental as an Anabaptist community that we ignore this need? Too often I hear "she brought it onto herself" or "that's what you get" instead of, "how can we help?".

It does seem really odd to me to include a question about blame for rape in the opening of a discussion on how to minister to those with unwanted pregnancies. Perhaps Ernie could shed some light on why this was included?

Yes, prevention is better than reacting, yet all of ministry is a response to the harm caused by sin, isn’t it?

[steve-in-kville]

It does seem really odd to me to include a question about blame for rape in the opening of a discussion on how to minister to those with unwanted pregnancies. Perhaps Ernie could shed some light on why this was included?

Yes, prevention is better than reacting, yet all of ministry is a response to the harm caused by sin, isn’t it?

Can't speak for Ernie but there is a mentality among some conservative Anabaptist that if a woman wears anything less than a cape dress and black stockings, she is responsible for a man's lust. Many years ago we were part of a fellowship that pushed that agenda.

[barnhart]

Matthew 25
"Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me."

From this passage I learn several values around ministry that God approves. First, presence is important, this also born out the parable of the Samaritan. It's also the first step in moving away from a lifestyle that insulates from poverty and need. Second, simple needs are high on God's list, food and water, hospitality and friendship, clothing and shelter, these are things he cares about. Third, start with these things before moving to other messages. The gospel he cares about starts with these things, ethical and moral teaching and gospel messages are important but certainly not a replacement for these things.

[ken_sylvania]

Our Chair of OB/GYN services had been looking for residential assistance for single mothers who were hesitant to abort but felt trapped. I wonder if any attempt has ever been made for that type of ministry to single mothers with unwanted pregnancy?

It seems to me that the hospitality and homemaking gifts many Mennonites have would set us up to be leaders in this type of ministry.

I’m much more interested in folks taking responsibility for the consequences of their choices moving forward than I’m assigning blame for past sins…

I haven't been participating in these threads but Anthony's reply brings up a valid point: are we too judgmental as an Anabaptist community that we ignore this need? Too often I hear "she brought it onto herself" or "that's what you get" instead of, "how can we help?".

It does seem really odd to me to include a question about blame for rape in the opening of a discussion on how to minister to those with unwanted pregnancies. Perhaps Ernie could shed some light on why this was included?

Yes, prevention is better than reacting, yet all of ministry is a response to the harm caused by sin, isn’t it?

Would it be fair to say that a well-rounded program of ministering to people with unwanted pregnancies would also, where applicable, address the behavior that "caused" the unwanted pregnancy? So that in the case of a person who "sleeps around" that behavior ought to be addressed. In the case of a pregnancy resulting from rape, wouldn't part of a complete ministry also include some discussions about whether there are measures that person could take to protect herself from rape moving forward? Which might include some advice such as "you should not get drunk in a bar with people you don't know and trust late at night." Not that there is any excuse whatsoever for a man to rape a drunk woman.

James parks his car by the curb in downtown Detroit, unlocked with the keys in the ignition. When his car gets stolen, it will be my opinion that it is partly his fault that his car got stolen. Not because the thief couldn't help himself. Not because the car being unlocked was any excuse for the thief. But because James was stupid and didn't take common sense measures to help prevent his car from being stolen (the police will tell him the same thing).

It fascinates me how people who can easily see how stupid it is for James to leave his car unlocked with the keys in the ignition will cry "victim blaming" as soon as a woman is advised to take preventive measures to avoid attacks or minimize unwanted attention.

[temporal1]

It might be helpful to gather testimonies from women who believe they were successfully helped, how that happened, when, where.
Many people dedicate themselves to both prevention, and response. Families adjust and provide.

Success stories take a distant back seat to shortcomings. This is known.

This situation/need/reality goes back to the beginning of time, before Jesus, but Mary inadvertantly and uniquely became a model for gracious acceptance of the highly unexpected. Our limited human brains are routinely surprised at how the unexpected+unwanted often turn into great blessings.

Poverty is not the worst thing that can happen. Scriptures assures of this in clear+bold ways.
Poverty does not equate to immorality/amorality or lack of souls/spirit. This is a sad message, it’s not Jesus’ message.
Scriptures rightly warn of wealth+comfort.

i expect the vast majority of unexpected/unwanted pregnancies are attended to within family units, unlikely getting any notice, no press. including adoptions within the family and/or close friends. i know of it in my family and extended family. i know of it in my family going back 100+ years, i’m confident, longer. Not frequent. It happened. It often happens quietly and seamlessly.

In former times, an “unwed mother” was taboo, shameful, causing family shame. i know of no comparison today.
an “inconvenience” does not at all compare.

i would be surprised to learn this is not the case within Anabaptist circles? .. i.e., families being first means of support?

As for gov subsidies, we see the horrors of fatherless homes, and men fathering multiple children with multiple females, being a husband/father to none. untold damage. beyond debate. another horror is grandparents robbed of their grandchildren and all the experiences that unfold with that. today - grparents can be lied to, with gov assisting those lies. tremendous societal damage.

There are positive testimonies that can reflect how to help, from mothers who were helped, also from grown people who avoided or survived abortion. It makes sense to listen+learn, “how to get things right.” A lot of good is accomplished already. Not in headlines.

(This is for those who do not equate the pronoun “we” with gov funding, call it done, then smugly walk away to more interesting passtimes.)