Russia Invades Ukraine 2022

[Dan Z]

Some of us are old enough to remember the Cold War and the distinct possibility of nuclear holocaust. I remember times, as a child, when that possibility loomed large. We'll, the recent actions of our friend Mr. Putin have highlighted the possibility once again. War is so unpredictable, and things can spiral out of control quickly. I'm very uneasy with potentially unhinged narcissistic strong-men autocrats - on either side of the ocean.

[nett]

Of course we can agree that war is bad.

I hope we can also agree there are many who profit from it. Going back to the time of the Romans and before. War profiteering is one of the oldest professions in history.

It is also usually good business for farmers. World War 2 is what saved my grandfather's farm after losing one in the depression and coming within an eyelash of losing another.

It's a shame mental gymnastics isn't an olympics sport, you would definitely be a contender for the gold medal.

It's not 1939, and we're not coming out the great depression. The small-scale family farm is going extinct, and corporate farms with razor thin margins are now the dominant.

I have know personal accounts of corn farmers who are not planting with the current prices as they are, because they will not be able to pay off off their credit lines as it stands currently. Is that a good thing Ken?

[nett]

Some of us are old enough to remember the Cold War and the distinct possibility of nuclear holocaust. I remember times, as a child, when that possibility loomed large. We'll, the recent actions of our friend Mr. Putin have highlighted the possibility once again. War is so unpredictable, and things can spiral out of control quickly. I'm very uneasy with potentially unhinged narcissistic strong-men autocrats - on either side of the ocean.

The only country to ever detonate a nuclear bomb in combat is the United States. Shouldn't Russia be worried about that?

[RZehr]

I found this interesting. I think the US signing in November was a mistake, a miscalculation. This is the first I’ve read about this “Charter on Strategic Partnership”.

The Russ­ian in­va­sion of Ukraine re­sulted from two im­mense strate­gic blun­ders, Robert Ser­vice says. The first came on Nov. 10, when the U.S. and Ukraine signed a Char­ter on Strate­gic Part­ner­ship, which as­serted Amer­i­ca’s sup­port for Kyiv’s right to pur­sue mem­ber­ship in the North At­lantic Treaty Or­ga­ni­za­tion. The pact made it like­lier than ever that Ukraine would even­tu­ally join NATO—an in­tol­er­a­ble prospect for Vladimir Putin. “It was the last straw,” Mr. Ser­vice says. Prepa­ra­tions im­me­di­ately be­gan for Rus­sia’s so-called spe­cial mil­i­tary op­er­a­tion in Ukraine.

The sec­ond strate­gic er­ror was Mr. Putin’s un­der­es­ti­ma­tion of his ri­vals. “He de­spises the West and what he sees as West­ern deca­dence,” Mr. Ser­vice says. “He had come to be­lieve that the West was a sham­bles, both po­lit­i­cally and cul­tur­ally.” He also thought that the lead­ers of the West were “of poor qual­ity, and in­ex­pe­ri­enced, in com­par­i­son with him­self. Af­ter all, he’s been in power 20 years.”

I don’t disagree with what is said about the West here. This is likely what pushes conservatives today toward Putin.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/cause-ukra ... 1646413200

[Soloist]

https://www.military.com/daily-news/202 ... _220304.nl

The posting of the videos showing captured Russian troops raised questions about whether Ukraine had violated Article 13 of the Geneva Conventions, calling for the protection of prisoners of war "against acts of violence or intimidation and against insults and public curiosity."

The captured Russian soldiers, and any Ukrainians captured by the Russians, were entitled to humane treatment and protections under the law of war and the Geneva Conventions, said Gary Solis, a Vietnam veteran, retired Marine judge advocate general and author of the book, "The Law of Armed Conflict."

"It's a violation" of Geneva to post the videos, but not what would be considered a "grave breach" to be taken up by a war crimes tribunal in The Hague, Solis said.

"Anybody who is captured is a prisoner of war" and must be shielded from abuse and provided medical treatment as a lawful combatant, he added. "Clearly, the Russians who were captured were wearing uniforms."

He compared what the Ukrainians had done more to a misdemeanor than a felony, and also noted that there was a positive humanitarian aspect of the videos in showing "proof of life" to the families of the captured troops.

Obviously not everyone in war actually follows the rules.

Although they may not be wearing uniforms, the civilians would be considered lawful combatants so long as they were wearing a sign or symbol of their allegiance, and simply carrying a weapon would qualify as such a sign, Solis said.

Interesting note added in, makes ya wonder how many civilians killed happened to also be carrying weapons.

[temporal1]

Some of us are old enough to remember the Cold War and the distinct possibility of nuclear holocaust. I remember times, as a child, when that possibility loomed large. We'll, the recent actions of our friend Mr. Putin have highlighted the possibility once again. War is so unpredictable, and things can spiral out of control quickly. I'm very uneasy with potentially unhinged narcissistic strong-men autocrats - on either side of the ocean.

We had a little relief between N Korea and Ukraine.
By the time DJT was elected, i was fairly resigned to the U.S. being hit, at least the “Left Coast,” probably where my family is in the PNW. i believed speculation he would lead to or result in war. (so, pleasantly surprised.)

i think of DJT as brusque and flamboyant, but not an actual strong-man. frankly, i’m more fearful of pretty faces with polite voices that kill behind backs. these can make me lose sleep.

Wars and strong-men populate history, all continents, no matter weaponry. “Where there’s a will, there’s a way.”
Thankfully, scriptures warn of reality on earth. It would be so much harder if not.

[mike]

Visa & Mastercard cutting out Russia

[Soloist]

What does the "free" world gain from creating a second North Korea with a much stronger base?

[Ken]

What does the "free" world gain from creating a second North Korea with a much stronger base?

Nothing. But they are creating it themselves by behaving utterly outside civilized norms. And rapidly falling into totalitarianism. Inside Russia it is now a crime punishable by 15 years in prison to contract the Kremlin's propaganda line on this war, or to even call it a war.

We have people on this forum who choose not to pay income taxes so that they are not supporting the Pentagon and the US war machine. How is that different from corporations and countries choosing not to do business with a regime that is waging a criminal war of aggression in Ukraine?

According to the International Tribunal at Nuremburg which Russia (or the USSR) participated in:

"War is essentially an evil thing. Its consequences are not confined to the belligerent states alone, but affect the whole world. To initiate a war of aggression, therefore, is not only an international crime; it is the supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole."

I think it is a good thing that much of the world is choosing not to be complicit in this war of aggression.

[Dan Z]

Some of us are old enough to remember the Cold War and the distinct possibility of nuclear holocaust. I remember times, as a child, when that possibility loomed large. We'll, the recent actions of our friend Mr. Putin have highlighted the possibility once again. War is so unpredictable, and things can spiral out of control quickly. I'm very uneasy with potentially unhinged narcissistic strong-men autocrats - on either side of the ocean.

The only country to ever detonate a nuclear bomb in combat is the United States. Shouldn't Russia be worried about that?

We all should be worried about that. Putin worries me more right now though - he's exhibiting an aggressive and threatening posture, has his nukes on alert, and I seriously think there are fewer checks on his power than there are in most of the western nuclear countries. In either case, nuclear war is unwinnable.