Can the Kingdom of God speak to political matters?

[Sudsy]

I believe we speak to the Kingdoms of this world by example. The world does it's thing and I co-operate, within the restrictions of serving the Lord, to live 'in this world' peacefully as much as possible but beyond that I am not to be 'of this world'. What this world does political wise are things 'of this world' which can be in conflict with the world I am to represent.

I really don't think I need to have an opinion on what worldly politics is up to. I am not a part of making the world a better place by their means of doing so. My role is to represent a world that has no end and this requires an eternal perspective which this world does not have.

Do I get sucked into political matters of this world ? Yes, sometimes I do. With the media access we have today and even from some Christian pulpits it is a challenge to stay away from this stuff and keep focus on the eternal. Scripture tells us what we need to focus on to guard our hearts. I find this an on-going challenge but believe one that can be overcome. When we became believers we did not lose our free will to chose to be an overcomer through the enabling power and direction of the Holy Spirit.

[joshuabgood]

Re OP. Yes...the Kingdom of God has something to say to the Kingdoms of this world. We should be challenging them to consider joining the Kingdom of God and adopting Kingdom principles in their practice. If we believe the methods of Jesus are more effective at combatting evil then why wouldn't we speak that?

[GaryK]

Sure, the Kingdom of God cannot merge with worldly politics...

You say you disagree with my statement but what you wrote above is what I've been saying all along. Now the question is, should those within the KOG merge with worldly politics? If one truly believes what you wrote above, I don't see how doing so is part of the KOG.

Thanks for the clarification. I agree with what you say here.

Do you really agree? I wonder if you read everything I said.

How is voting in a worldly political system not merging with it? Voting is one of the most fundamental aspects of worldly politics.

[GaryK]

Re OP. Yes...the Kingdom of God has something to say to the Kingdoms of this world. We should be challenging them to consider joining the Kingdom of God and adopting Kingdom principles in their practice. If we believe the methods of Jesus are more effective at combatting evil then why wouldn't we speak that?

Who is the "them" you refer to? Is it the system in general or the individuals within the systems?

If you are referring to the individuals within the systems, should our challenge to them to join the KOG be any different than it is to individuals who are not part of these governments?

[joshuabgood]

Re OP. Yes...the Kingdom of God has something to say to the Kingdoms of this world. We should be challenging them to consider joining the Kingdom of God and adopting Kingdom principles in their practice. If we believe the methods of Jesus are more effective at combatting evil then why wouldn't we speak that?

Who is the "them" you refer to? Is it the system in general or the individuals within the systems?

If you are referring to the individuals within the systems, should our challenge to them to join the KOG be any different than it is to individuals who are not part of these governments?

I would say the "them" is all of the above.

[Sudsy]

Re OP. Yes...the Kingdom of God has something to say to the Kingdoms of this world. We should be challenging them to consider joining the Kingdom of God and adopting Kingdom principles in their practice. If we believe the methods of Jesus are more effective at combatting evil then why wouldn't we speak that?

I agree we have 'something to say to the Kingdoms of this world.' What we initially have to say is the Gospel message and when individuals accept that message they receive a changed heart which causes them to want to follow Jesus. Then discipleship training begins.

It isn't a matter of speaking to political matters but rather soul matters. Proverbs 11:30 says - 'The fruit of the righteous is a tree of life; and he that winneth souls is wise.' Matthew Henry comments - “He that is wise, by communicating his wisdom, wins souls, wins upon them to bring them in love with God and holiness, and so wins them over into the interests of God’s kingdom among men”.

Being wise is not sorting out the good and the bad that worldly politics is involved in. This is worldly stuff that will all pass away. Pointing others to Jesus and His offer of eternal life is what the Gospel is based on. Our changed hearts and lives should be an example of what it means to live in the now of the KOG. The fruit of having God live within us in the person of the Holy Spirit is a means God uses to display the KOG. And as Romans 10 says, words too are necessary for others to know what Jesus has done for our salvation.

To your post question - good question. As Jesus said to Nicodemus (John 3) the ability to see the KOG requires one to be born again / born of the Spirit. When Christians think they can get people to 'follow Jesus' without being born again, then they are just preaching a religion that is not a heart changing happening as was the religion of the Pharisees in Jesus day. Very religious folk that had not had a heart transplant.

[GaryK]

Re OP. Yes...the Kingdom of God has something to say to the Kingdoms of this world. We should be challenging them to consider joining the Kingdom of God and adopting Kingdom principles in their practice. If we believe the methods of Jesus are more effective at combatting evil then why wouldn't we speak that?

Who is the "them" you refer to? Is it the system in general or the individuals within the systems?

If you are referring to the individuals within the systems, should our challenge to them to join the KOG be any different than it is to individuals who are not part of these governments?

I would say the "them" is all of the above.

Are you suggesting a merger of the 2 Kingdoms when you say "We should challenge them to consider joining the Kingdom of God and adopting Kingdom principles in their practice"?

[joshuabgood]

Who is the "them" you refer to? Is it the system in general or the individuals within the systems?

If you are referring to the individuals within the systems, should our challenge to them to join the KOG be any different than it is to individuals who are not part of these governments?

I would say the "them" is all of the above.

Are you suggesting a merger of the 2 Kingdoms when you say "We should challenge them to consider joining the Kingdom of God and adopting Kingdom principles in their practice"?

I am suggesting a take-over. A peaceful revolution as the Sattler folks are fond of saying.

[joshuabgood]

Re OP. Yes...the Kingdom of God has something to say to the Kingdoms of this world. We should be challenging them to consider joining the Kingdom of God and adopting Kingdom principles in their practice. If we believe the methods of Jesus are more effective at combatting evil then why wouldn't we speak that?

I agree we have 'something to say to the Kingdoms of this world.' What we initially have to say is the Gospel message...

Ah but there is a big question...what in fact is "the gospel?" What is salvation? Some would feel the Protestant formulations of personal salvation and general personal absolution of sin and a "pie in the sky when we die" are not particularly faithful to the life and witness of Jesus, scripture, or intuitively compelling.

As Matthew Bates says, "eternal life" isn't even the gospel. It is a benefit of the gospel. The gospel in its barest essence is, Jesus is King - the rule and reign of God has been established on earth as also in heaven.

[GaryK]

I would say the "them" is all of the above.

Are you suggesting a merger of the 2 Kingdoms when you say "We should challenge them to consider joining the Kingdom of God and adopting Kingdom principles in their practice"?

I am suggesting a take-over. A peaceful revolution as the Sattler folks are fond of saying.

I think I'm understanding what you're saying. Do you know of any time period in church history where the sort of revolution you are thinking of attempted to take over the affairs of earthly governance?