The only things I remember telling you was that vaccines reduce your chance of catching Covid and reduce both the risk of hospitalization and death relative to being unvaccinated. They also happen to reduce the severity of the disease when people do get sick, and they reduce the infectiousness of people who do still catch Covid despite being vaccinated.
The fact that you can’t find data from anywhere in the US (or anywhere else in the developed world) showing vaccinated people getting sick or dying at higher rates than unvaccinated is pretty clear and compelling evidence that I’m right.
In my own immediate and extended family, between my wife and me we have four parents who are all in their late 80s, the five of us in my generation are all in our 50s, and we have 3 kids ranging from age 15 to 23 for a total of 12 people across three generations. Several of us work in professions that are at pretty high risk of exposure to Covid. We are all 100% vaccinated and not one person in our extended family has caught covid in the past 2 years. So the results speak for themselves.
None of this is particularly complicated. It is a virus. The science of virology is old and well established. We know how it replicates and spreads and we know how it makes people sick and kills them. We also know there are basic things you can do to prevent getting the disease and prevent it from spreading. The fact that far too many people are in denial about that is why we are where we are today.
That means your whole friend and family group spent a year before the vaccines were available without getting sick too.
Since it's so well understood, explain why scientists are baffled by the rapid evolution of an ancient type of virus.
“Omicron was a huge jump in evolution,” says Jesse Bloom, an evolutionary virologist at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center, in Seattle. In what seems to be just a few months, the virus has changed as much as Bloom says he and many researchers expected it to change “over the span of four or five years.”
nett wrote: ↑Fri Dec 10, 2021 1:52 pm That means your whole friend and family group spent a year before the vaccines were available without getting sick too.
Yes, we took basic precautions and all lived in states and countries where the local and state authorities too the pandemic seriously and took measures to keep it under control as best as they could. It worked. What state do you live in?
Since it's so well understood, explain why scientists are baffled by the rapid evolution of an ancient type of virus.
I didn’t say every aspect of Covid was completely understood. We don’t completely understand everything about even the simplest and most common substances like water. But we do know a lot about it.
We also know a tremendous amount about viruses. We know what they are, how they invade cells and replicate. How different types of viruses spread and propagate from blood-borne viruses like HIV to respiratory airborne viruses like Covid. We also know how to prevent viral infections through vaccines and how to limit their spread through basic sanitation and behavior. None of this is new or particularly completed. We have been studying and fighting viruses and infectious disease for many many decades.
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Ken wrote: ↑Fri Dec 10, 2021 2:21 pm
We also know how to prevent viral infections through vaccines and how to limit their spread through basic sanitation and behavior.
Ken wrote: ↑Fri Dec 10, 2021 2:21 pm
We also know how to prevent viral infections through vaccines and how to limit their spread through basic sanitation and behavior.
So vaccines prevent infection?
Yes. Not completely in the case of Covid, but yes. So maybe “reduce infections” is more technically accurate in the case of Covid. But yes, vaccines do prevent infections of a wide variety of viruses from smallpox to polio to MMR.
Of course you are completely sidestepping the basic point that I made which is that if you are correct then you should have hundreds of examples of different jurisdictions where you will find higher hospitalization and death rates for vaccinated individuals than unvaccinated individuals. The fact that you can’t find a single example makes my point.
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Ken wrote: ↑Fri Dec 10, 2021 2:21 pm
We also know how to prevent viral infections through vaccines and how to limit their spread through basic sanitation and behavior.
So vaccines prevent infection?
Yes. Not completely in the case of Covid, but yes. So maybe “reduce infections” is more technically accurate in the case of Covid. But yes, vaccines do prevent infections of a wide variety of viruses from smallpox to polio to MMR.
Of course you are completely sidestepping the basic point that I made which is that if you are correct then you should have hundreds of examples of different jurisdictions where you will find higher hospitalization and death rates for vaccinated individuals than unvaccinated individuals. The fact that you can’t find a single example makes my point.
I already told that I don't trust the numbers that are being reported. I have a lot of reasons for that, some of them firsthand
nett wrote: ↑Fri Dec 10, 2021 4:07 pmI already told that I don't trust the numbers that are being reported. I have a lot of reasons for that, some of them firsthand
For someone who doesn’t “trust the numbers” you sure bombard us with a lot of them. So obviously the only numbers you don’t trust are those that conflict with the narrative you are pushing.
Everyone else is just lying then? Like, for example, the local public health authorities in Holmes County who report that 96% of their Covid hospitalizations and 94% of their Covid deaths have been from unvaccinated patients? https://www.holmeshealth.org/corona-virus-covid-19/
MARQUETTE, Mich. (WLUC) - Upper Michigan’s largest intensive care unit remains full as Michigan’s COVID-19 hospitalizations have reached a new high.
The latest state health department data shows 79 adults are in U.P. hospitals right now with COVID-19. Twenty-two of them are in intensive care, and eight are on a ventilator.
UP Health System - Marquette CEO Gar Atchison says “this is clearly the wave of the unvaccinated.” He says 100% of COVID-19 patients in Marquette’s ICU right now are unvaccinated, and those unvaccinated patients have kept the ICU full for months.
“Get one out, get one in, constantly,” he said.
Beds are opening up because COVID-19 patients are dying.
“We’re having COVID deaths on a daily basis,” said Atchison.
All lies to mislead you?
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
nett wrote: ↑Fri Dec 10, 2021 4:07 pmI already told that I don't trust the numbers that are being reported. I have a lot of reasons for that, some of them firsthand
For someone who doesn’t “trust the numbers” you sure bombard us with a lot of them. So obviously the only numbers you don’t trust are those that conflict with the narrative you are pushing.
Everyone else is just lying then? Like, for example, the local public health authorities in Holmes County who report that 96% of their Covid hospitalizations and 94% of their Covid deaths have been from unvaccinated patients? https://www.holmeshealth.org/corona-virus-covid-19/
MARQUETTE, Mich. (WLUC) - Upper Michigan’s largest intensive care unit remains full as Michigan’s COVID-19 hospitalizations have reached a new high.
The latest state health department data shows 79 adults are in U.P. hospitals right now with COVID-19. Twenty-two of them are in intensive care, and eight are on a ventilator.
UP Health System - Marquette CEO Gar Atchison says “this is clearly the wave of the unvaccinated.” He says 100% of COVID-19 patients in Marquette’s ICU right now are unvaccinated, and those unvaccinated patients have kept the ICU full for months.
“Get one out, get one in, constantly,” he said.
Beds are opening up because COVID-19 patients are dying.
“We’re having COVID deaths on a daily basis,” said Atchison.
All lies to mislead you?
If you publicly question vaccine efficacy, you get canceled. most people can't afford to have that happen, because they are completely dependent on the system. Yeah, most people will lie to keep their jobs and status.
I posted a story about a people who told the truth, and look at what happened.
nett wrote: ↑Fri Dec 10, 2021 4:55 pm
If you publicly question vaccine efficacy, you get canceled. most people can't afford to have that happen, because they are completely dependent on the system. Yeah, most people will lie to keep their jobs and status.
I posted a story about a people who told the truth, and look at what happened.
What story? I’m just catching up and missed about 300 pages of my thread
Just a note, I am not opposed to vaccines, but found this video interesting. Much of what he says in the video, is what Dr. Yeager was saying a year ago.
nett wrote: ↑Fri Dec 10, 2021 4:55 pm
If you publicly question vaccine efficacy, you get canceled. most people can't afford to have that happen, because they are completely dependent on the system. Yeah, most people will lie to keep their jobs and status.
I posted a story about a people who told the truth, and look at what happened.
What story? I’m just catching up and missed about 300 pages of my thread
