Ivermectin

Things that are not part of politics happening presently and how we approach or address it as Anabaptists.
Soloist

Re: Ivermectin

Post by Soloist »

Josh wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:53 pm Vaccines do not wane in effectiveness to the point of needing five-month booster shots.

I’ve been using vaccines my entire life. Ken, exactly which mainstream vaccine before the covid era required boosters every five months, of every year?

The only booster I’ve ever needed to take was a TDAP every 10 years. And I’ve never had to get a vaccine passport before for any vaccine I’ve taken to go to a grocery store, or to keep my job.
Just to be clear here, vaccines do wane in effectiveness. This is why we need multiple of some vaccines. Now poor vaccines require more boosters and may end up not working entirely. The pertussis vaccine isn't super effective but it was before it got reformulated to remove Thiomersal from it...

The question really should be, is there much point in using a booster when the base protection is 55%? I would think they need a new vaccine for the variants. The problem is, they stated repeatedly that they were targeting a section of the virus that did not pose a threat to mutation. Clearly they were wrong. Now what can they target that would actually be effective? This could be a strong argument against partial vaccines such as the ones out now or it could be a strong argument for the inability to actually vaccinate for coronaviruses... Time will tell.
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Ken
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Re: Ivermectin

Post by Ken »

Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:38 pm
Josh wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:53 pm Vaccines do not wane in effectiveness to the point of needing five-month booster shots.

I’ve been using vaccines my entire life. Ken, exactly which mainstream vaccine before the covid era required boosters every five months, of every year?

The only booster I’ve ever needed to take was a TDAP every 10 years. And I’ve never had to get a vaccine passport before for any vaccine I’ve taken to go to a grocery store, or to keep my job.
Just to be clear here, vaccines do wane in effectiveness. This is why we need multiple of some vaccines. Now poor vaccines require more boosters and may end up not working entirely. The pertussis vaccine isn't super effective but it was before it got reformulated to remove Thiomersal from it...

The question really should be, is there much point in using a booster when the base protection is 55%? I would think they need a new vaccine for the variants. The problem is, they stated repeatedly that they were targeting a section of the virus that did not pose a threat to mutation. Clearly they were wrong. Now what can they target that would actually be effective? This could be a strong argument against partial vaccines such as the ones out now or it could be a strong argument for the inability to actually vaccinate for coronaviruses... Time will tell.
The flu shot wanes in effectiveness, which is why they give it every year in the fall at the start of flu season not any random time. It is the virus that most closely resembles Covid.

The Tdap vaccine when given to adults who have never had it as a child is a 3-shot regime. You get the first booster in 4 weeks, and then the 3rd booster in 6-12 months. It is possible that Covid might require a similar 3-shot regime to confer long-term immunity. Or it might require annual boosters. We are still learning.

You guys do what you want. I'll trust the science and get a booster if/when recommended. Following the science has been the best course of action so far. Those who get vaccinated are far better protected against severe illness or death than those who avoid the vaccines and take hydroxychloroquine or Ivermectin instead.
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Soloist

Re: Ivermectin

Post by Soloist »

Ken wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:47 pm The flu shot wanes in effectiveness, which is why they give it every year in the fall at the start of flu season not any random time. It is the virus that most closely resembles Covid.

The Tdap vaccine when given to adults who have never had it as a child is a 3-shot regime. You get the first booster in 4 weeks, and then the 3rd booster in 6-12 months. It is possible that Covid might require a similar 3-shot regime to confer long-term immunity. Or it might require annual boosters. We are still learning.

You guys do what you want. I'll trust the science and get a booster if/when recommended. Following the science has been the best course of action so far. Those who get vaccinated are far better protected against severe illness or death than those who avoid the vaccines and take hydroxychloroquine or Ivermectin instead.
I'm open to being wrong, but I've always heard the flu shot has nothing to do with waning effectiveness but rather targeting the most likely dominant strain that year.
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Josh

Re: Ivermectin

Post by Josh »

Ken wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:47 pm
Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:38 pm
Josh wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 4:53 pm Vaccines do not wane in effectiveness to the point of needing five-month booster shots.

I’ve been using vaccines my entire life. Ken, exactly which mainstream vaccine before the covid era required boosters every five months, of every year?

The only booster I’ve ever needed to take was a TDAP every 10 years. And I’ve never had to get a vaccine passport before for any vaccine I’ve taken to go to a grocery store, or to keep my job.
Just to be clear here, vaccines do wane in effectiveness. This is why we need multiple of some vaccines. Now poor vaccines require more boosters and may end up not working entirely. The pertussis vaccine isn't super effective but it was before it got reformulated to remove Thiomersal from it...

The question really should be, is there much point in using a booster when the base protection is 55%? I would think they need a new vaccine for the variants. The problem is, they stated repeatedly that they were targeting a section of the virus that did not pose a threat to mutation. Clearly they were wrong. Now what can they target that would actually be effective? This could be a strong argument against partial vaccines such as the ones out now or it could be a strong argument for the inability to actually vaccinate for coronaviruses... Time will tell.
The flu shot wanes in effectiveness, which is why they give it every year in the fall at the start of flu season not any random time. It is the virus that most closely resembles Covid.

The Tdap vaccine when given to adults who have never had it as a child is a 3-shot regime. You get the first booster in 4 weeks, and then the 3rd booster in 6-12 months. It is possible that Covid might require a similar 3-shot regime to confer long-term immunity. Or it might require annual boosters. We are still learning.

You guys do what you want. I'll trust the science and get a booster if/when recommended. Following the science has been the best course of action so far. Those who get vaccinated are far better protected against severe illness or death than those who avoid the vaccines and take hydroxychloroquine or Ivermectin instead.
Ken,

You’re repeating complete misinformation here. Would you care to correct yourself?
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Ken
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Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:02 am
Location: Washington State
Affiliation: former MCUSA

Re: Ivermectin

Post by Ken »

Josh wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:52 pm
Ken wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:47 pm
Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:38 pm

Just to be clear here, vaccines do wane in effectiveness. This is why we need multiple of some vaccines. Now poor vaccines require more boosters and may end up not working entirely. The pertussis vaccine isn't super effective but it was before it got reformulated to remove Thiomersal from it...

The question really should be, is there much point in using a booster when the base protection is 55%? I would think they need a new vaccine for the variants. The problem is, they stated repeatedly that they were targeting a section of the virus that did not pose a threat to mutation. Clearly they were wrong. Now what can they target that would actually be effective? This could be a strong argument against partial vaccines such as the ones out now or it could be a strong argument for the inability to actually vaccinate for coronaviruses... Time will tell.
The flu shot wanes in effectiveness, which is why they give it every year in the fall at the start of flu season not any random time. It is the virus that most closely resembles Covid.

The Tdap vaccine when given to adults who have never had it as a child is a 3-shot regime. You get the first booster in 4 weeks, and then the 3rd booster in 6-12 months. It is possible that Covid might require a similar 3-shot regime to confer long-term immunity. Or it might require annual boosters. We are still learning.

You guys do what you want. I'll trust the science and get a booster if/when recommended. Following the science has been the best course of action so far. Those who get vaccinated are far better protected against severe illness or death than those who avoid the vaccines and take hydroxychloroquine or Ivermectin instead.
Ken,

You’re repeating complete misinformation here. Would you care to correct yourself?
Intraseason waning of flu shot effectiveness. Study and discussion published in May 2019, before the Covid pandemic: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30204855/

3-dose vaccination schedule for Tdap: https://www.immunize.org/catg.d/p2055.pdf
0 x
A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Somebody

Re: Ivermectin

Post by Somebody »

Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:51 pm
Ken wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:47 pm The flu shot wanes in effectiveness, which is why they give it every year in the fall at the start of flu season not any random time. It is the virus that most closely resembles Covid.

The Tdap vaccine when given to adults who have never had it as a child is a 3-shot regime. You get the first booster in 4 weeks, and then the 3rd booster in 6-12 months. It is possible that Covid might require a similar 3-shot regime to confer long-term immunity. Or it might require annual boosters. We are still learning.

You guys do what you want. I'll trust the science and get a booster if/when recommended. Following the science has been the best course of action so far. Those who get vaccinated are far better protected against severe illness or death than those who avoid the vaccines and take hydroxychloroquine or Ivermectin instead.
I'm open to being wrong, but I've always heard the flu shot has nothing to do with waning effectiveness but rather targeting the most likely dominant strain that year.
This is what I always heard too. My aunt who is a nurse, isn't all that impressed with the annual flu shot, because too often they guess wrong on which strains will be the dominant ones.
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Soloist

Re: Ivermectin

Post by Soloist »

Somebody wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:01 pm
Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:51 pm
Ken wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 5:47 pm The flu shot wanes in effectiveness, which is why they give it every year in the fall at the start of flu season not any random time. It is the virus that most closely resembles Covid.

The Tdap vaccine when given to adults who have never had it as a child is a 3-shot regime. You get the first booster in 4 weeks, and then the 3rd booster in 6-12 months. It is possible that Covid might require a similar 3-shot regime to confer long-term immunity. Or it might require annual boosters. We are still learning.

You guys do what you want. I'll trust the science and get a booster if/when recommended. Following the science has been the best course of action so far. Those who get vaccinated are far better protected against severe illness or death than those who avoid the vaccines and take hydroxychloroquine or Ivermectin instead.
I'm open to being wrong, but I've always heard the flu shot has nothing to do with waning effectiveness but rather targeting the most likely dominant strain that year.
This is what I always heard too. My aunt who is a nurse, isn't all that impressed with the annual flu shot, because too often they guess wrong on which strains will be the dominant ones.
Seasonal flu vaccines are designed to protect against the influenza viruses that research indicates will be most common during the upcoming season. All flu vaccines in the United States are “quadrivalent” vaccines, which means they protect against four different flu viruses; an influenza A(H1N1) virus, an influenza A(H3N2) virus, and two influenza B viruses.
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/prevent/keyfacts.htm

Looks to me like Ken is wrong
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Ken
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Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:02 am
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Re: Ivermectin

Post by Ken »

Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:46 pm Looks to me like Ken is wrong
Sorry to burst your bubble of glee. But if you scroll down in the very CDC page that you linked to above you will find the following:
WHY DO I NEED A FLU VACCINE EVERY YEAR?

A flu vaccine is needed every year for two reasons. First, a person’s immune protection from vaccination declines over time, so an annual flu vaccine is needed for optimal protection. Second, because flu viruses are constantly changing, the composition of flu vaccines is reviewed annually and vaccines are updated to protect against the viruses that research indicates will be most common during the upcoming flu season. For the best protection, everyone 6 months and older should get vaccinated annually.
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A fool can throw out more questions than a wise man can answer. -RZehr
Josh

Re: Ivermectin

Post by Josh »

Ken wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:46 pm
Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Aug 29, 2021 7:46 pm Looks to me like Ken is wrong
Sorry to burst your bubble of glee. But if you scroll down in the very CDC page that you linked to above you will find the following:
WHY DO I NEED A FLU VACCINE EVERY YEAR?

A flu vaccine is needed every year for two reasons. First, a person’s immune protection from vaccination declines over time, so an annual flu vaccine is needed for optimal protection. Second, because flu viruses are constantly changing, the composition of flu vaccines is reviewed annually and vaccines are updated to protect against the viruses that research indicates will be most common during the upcoming flu season. For the best protection, everyone 6 months and older should get vaccinated annually.
The flu shot is in an ineffective vaccine that hasn’t done much at all to prevent flu pandemics which keep happening every year. (I got a flu shot in 2015, and then endured catching the Brisbane Flu a few months later despite being fully vaccinated.) Flu shots don’t accomplish much except making money for everyone involved.

The flu constantly changes and has new variants - much like covid. Old flu shots are completely useless against new variants. Non-sterilising vaccines like this can actually promote variants a d make pandemics worse.
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nett
Posts: 1953
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Re: Ivermectin

Post by nett »

With what we're seeing about the vaccines leaking, and variants basically popping up out of no where that appear to be specifically resistant to the vaccine, There is actually a reasonable argument to me made that those who received the vaccine and never contracted COVID are the ones out actively harming their neighbor.

By choosing to try to protect themselves individually with a prophylactic, instead of allowing the disease to run it's course, it might actually turn out to be significantly more harmful to the health of others.

With Israel and other countries announcing dates at which time two-dose vaccinated people will be considered "unvaccinated", things are going to get interesting for sure.

One thing we now know though is that the initial narrative that not getting vaccinated was selfish and not "caring for your neighbor" is completely blown out of the water. It turns out contracting COVID, and simply staying away from others at risk while contagious was the kindest, most responsible thing to do.
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