Covid-19 Vaccines and Christian Ethics

[Valerie]

Is there a way to find out # of deaths due to the vaccines? That can be trusted,?

Short answer? No.

Reports of vaccine side effects are collected by the government here: https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/ensur ... index.html

But you can't use that information to answer your question because they don't have a systematic way of attributing deaths to the vaccine. Linking a specific death to the vaccine is problematic, especially if the patient had other co-morbidities. If you give the vaccine to a 90 year old patient with a heart condition and chronic respiratory problems and they die 2-weeks later was that due to the vaccine? Also most deaths are not systematically autopsied. I think the actual autopsy rate is only about 5%.

Right. And that is why so many people had a problem with the number of deaths that were blamed on covid when they had many other health issues going on at the same time. You just simply could not trust the numbers.
I find this then to be quite the double standard to deny vaccine deaths based on the fact the patient might have had other health issues. But it was okay to blame covet on a death even though the person has several other health issues going on at the same time do you not see the hypocrisy in that???

[Ken]

Is there a way to find out # of deaths due to the vaccines? That can be trusted,?

Short answer? No.

Reports of vaccine side effects are collected by the government here: https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/ensur ... index.html

But you can't use that information to answer your question because they don't have a systematic way of attributing deaths to the vaccine. Linking a specific death to the vaccine is problematic, especially if the patient had other co-morbidities. If you give the vaccine to a 90 year old patient with a heart condition and chronic respiratory problems and they die 2-weeks later was that due to the vaccine? Also most deaths are not systematically autopsied. I think the actual autopsy rate is only about 5%.

Right. And that is why so many people had a problem with the number of deaths that were blamed on covid when they had many other health issues going on at the same time. You just simply could not trust the numbers.
I find this then to be quite the double standard to deny vaccine deaths based on the fact the patient might have had other health issues. But it was okay to blame covet on a death even though the person has several other health issues going on at the same time do you not see the hypocrisy in that???

To be fair, if someone tests positive for Covid-19 and dies on a ventilator of respiratory failure with hypoxemia when their blood oxygen drops to 50% that's a pretty easy call to make. I don't think hospitals generally have all that much difficulty identifying Covid patients.

[silentreader]

Is there a way to find out # of deaths due to the vaccines? That can be trusted,?

This is the version covering EU nations. It will also not supply vaccine deaths verified by autopsy.

https://www.adrreports.eu/en/index.html

As near as I can tell as of June 19, 2021 there have been 15,472 deaths linked to the 4 vaccines used in the EU.
However, same as Covid deaths, it depends how you count them, as "with" or "from".
In the same time frame and in the same locale it appears there were 1,509,266 "injuries" related to vaccines, of which 753,657 were considered serious, requiring some form of medical intervention to prevent a negative outcome.
Approximately half of the "injuries" (52%?) were reported by a medical practitioner.
Again, there is the "with" or "from" question.

[Soloist]

It would also be nice if they could compare the data from people vaccinated in January to those vaccinated later with the rate climbs between them.

[Ken]

Is there a way to find out # of deaths due to the vaccines? That can be trusted,?

This is the version covering EU nations. It will also not supply vaccine deaths verified by autopsy.

https://www.adrreports.eu/en/index.html

As near as I can tell as of June 19, 2021 there have been 15,472 deaths linked to the 4 vaccines used in the EU.
However, same as Covid deaths, it depends how you count them, as "with" or "from".
In the same time frame and in the same locale it appears there were 1,509,266 "injuries" related to vaccines, of which 753,657 were considered serious, requiring some form of medical intervention to prevent a negative outcome.
Approximately half of the "injuries" (52%?) were reported by a medical practitioner.
Again, there is the "with" or "from" question.

Is that information you pulled out of the EU data web site reference above? Or some other source? Because I see no such numbers on the EU web site.

[silentreader]

This is the version covering EU nations. It will also not supply vaccine deaths verified by autopsy.

https://www.adrreports.eu/en/index.html

As near as I can tell as of June 19, 2021 there have been 15,472 deaths linked to the 4 vaccines used in the EU.
However, same as Covid deaths, it depends how you count them, as "with" or "from".
In the same time frame and in the same locale it appears there were 1,509,266 "injuries" related to vaccines, of which 753,657 were considered serious, requiring some form of medical intervention to prevent a negative outcome.
Approximately half of the "injuries" (52%?) were reported by a medical practitioner.
Again, there is the "with" or "from" question.

Is that information you pulled out of the EU data web site reference above? Or some other source? Because I see no such numbers on the EU web site.

You have to go down a lot of trails from the website to find the actual numbers, broken down to type of injury and numbers of type of injury for each of the 4 shots.

[nett]

Short answer? No.

Reports of vaccine side effects are collected by the government here: https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/ensur ... index.html

But you can't use that information to answer your question because they don't have a systematic way of attributing deaths to the vaccine. Linking a specific death to the vaccine is problematic, especially if the patient had other co-morbidities. If you give the vaccine to a 90 year old patient with a heart condition and chronic respiratory problems and they die 2-weeks later was that due to the vaccine? Also most deaths are not systematically autopsied. I think the actual autopsy rate is only about 5%.

Right. And that is why so many people had a problem with the number of deaths that were blamed on covid when they had many other health issues going on at the same time. You just simply could not trust the numbers.
I find this then to be quite the double standard to deny vaccine deaths based on the fact the patient might have had other health issues. But it was okay to blame covet on a death even though the person has several other health issues going on at the same time do you not see the hypocrisy in that???

To be fair, if someone tests positive for Covid-19 and dies on a ventilator of respiratory failure with hypoxemia when their blood oxygen drops to 50% that's a pretty easy call to make. I don't think hospitals generally have all that much difficulty identifying Covid patients.

What about my neighbor. She was in a nursing home, and contracted COVID last year. She recovered fully, but ending up dying in February. Her daughter had to obtain an online ordination so she could enter her room as an end-of-life visit. Her daughter said she was not having trouble breathing and had no cough. She died peacefully, essentially of old-age.

Care to guess what the nursing home documented as cause of death?

[mennonitemom1]

pharmakeia is a “work of the flesh” listed in Galatians 5:19-20 (translated as “witchcraft”) that’s what I think about “big pharma”
It’s also a word used in revelation

[mennonitemom1]

Revelation 18:23 says “And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries [PHARMACEIA] )Strong’s G5531) were all nations deceived.”

[RZehr]

Today “witchcraft” means witchcraft. “Pharmacy” means pharmacy.

To say that they are the same thing today, based on the “pharmakeia” is like saying olives and engine oil are the same thing.