MaxPC wrote: ↑Wed Jul 07, 2021 5:32 am
Oh my; rather than apologising to those who have been offended, the person who is disruptive is now attacking with name calling, using terms such as "Goon Squad". That is not a very good sign for repentance.
And on being offended, I for one, have never been offended by his posts, just vehemently disagree with some. But then I guess I am not easily offended.
Grace, indeed that is calling names in any culture. It certainly does not help the conversation either as it is completely hostile and to those who have been the object of that hostility and expressed it, they are offended. Regarding the person who is disruptive, I do not see any humility by accepting the call of accountability nor in repentance through apology. Rather than this name calling, I advise this person to take a break from the forum and reflect on how better to be a peaceful participant. I like these verses: Galatians 5:22-23
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.
Jesus rebuked; some heeded that rebuke. I think it's always good to hear what several others are pointing out and to reflect.
MaxPC wrote: ↑Wed Jul 07, 2021 9:20 am
Grace, indeed that is calling names in any culture. It certainly does not help the conversation either as it is completely hostile and to those who have been the object of that hostility and expressed it, they are offended. Regarding the person who is disruptive, I do not see any humility by accepting the call of accountability nor in repentance through apology. Rather than this name calling, I advise this person to take a break from the forum and reflect on how better to be a peaceful participant. I like these verses: Galatians 5:22-23
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.
Jesus rebuked; some heeded that rebuke. I think it's always good to hear what several others are pointing out and to reflect.
Using the word "goon squad" as noun would be name calling. But I don't think Boostrap was using the word as a noun, but as an adjective describing certain threads. But he can speak for himself. Let's make sure we don't interject or purport something that wasn't said.
MaxPC wrote: ↑Wed Jul 07, 2021 9:20 amGrace, indeed that is calling names in any culture. It certainly does not help the conversation either as it is completely hostile and to those who have been the object of that hostility and expressed it, they are offended. Regarding the person who is disruptive, I do not see any humility by accepting the call of accountability nor in repentance through apology. Rather than this name calling, I advise this person to take a break from the forum and reflect on how better to be a peaceful participant. I like these verses: Galatians 5:22-23
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.
Jesus rebuked; some heeded that rebuke. I think it's always good to hear what several others are pointing out and to reflect.
Using the word "goon squad" as noun would be name calling. But I don't think Boostrap was using the word as a noun, but as an adjective describing certain threads. But he can speak for himself. Let's make sure we don't interject or purport something that wasn't said.
Yes, I think I generally try to describe threads or tactics rather than people. I really don't think we are called to be judges of others, except for those who are in a pastoral role where they actually have that jurisdiction.
Same for the word 'hostile' in this thread, I also try to avoid saying things like "you are a hostile person" or try to depict the inner working of someone else's soul - "filled with hate" or whatever. I don't think I have the ability, right, or calling to judge people like that.
I really am trying to avoid targeting people or beating them down. But I am also trying to find ways to turn the conversation to facts and such.
JimFoxvog wrote: ↑Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:05 am
I think the point is valid and important, but I think the term "Goon Squad" is similar to name-calling and makes MN more hostile. Might it not be better to call out this behavior with just the description of what one is seeing? Something like, "this post targets a person rather than discuss the topic."
That's the kind of thing I said for years - it pretty much always gets lost in the noise. There's usually some loud denouncing going on when I feel the need to pull it out. The good thing about the phrase "Goon Squad tactics" is that it doesn't get lost in the noise like that. Is there another phrase that would work as well without getting lost in the noise?
Not directing this to anyone specific... but how hard is it to simply walk away from a thread when it goes sideways? Or do we have to always be right or have the last word? There were a few times I had to do this just because I didn't want to damage a relationship, even an online one. Just asking.
steve-in-kville wrote: ↑Wed Jul 07, 2021 2:39 pm
Not directing this to anyone specific... but how hard is it to simply walk away from a thread when it goes sideways? Or do we have to always be right or have the last word? There were a few times I had to do this just because I didn't want to damage a relationship, even an online one. Just asking.
I used to enjoy fighting on the internet. I’ll walk away from a discussion now because it’s just not worth the emotion and time to commit to it.
JimFoxvog wrote: ↑Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:05 am
I think the point is valid and important, but I think the term "Goon Squad" is similar to name-calling and makes MN more hostile. Might it not be better to call out this behavior with just the description of what one is seeing? Something like, "this post targets a person rather than discuss the topic."
That's the kind of thing I said for years - it pretty much always gets lost in the noise. There's usually some loud denouncing going on when I feel the need to pull it out. The good thing about the phrase "Goon Squad tactics" is that it doesn't get lost in the noise like that. Is there another phrase that would work as well without getting lost in the noise?
I don't think it gets lost in the noise for those who are listening. Some won't listen, but I don't think "goon squad" helps lower anyone's hostility.
JimFoxvog wrote: ↑Wed Jul 07, 2021 8:05 am
I think the point is valid and important, but I think the term "Goon Squad" is similar to name-calling and makes MN more hostile. Might it not be better to call out this behavior with just the description of what one is seeing? Something like, "this post targets a person rather than discuss the topic."
That's the kind of thing I said for years - it pretty much always gets lost in the noise. There's usually some loud denouncing going on when I feel the need to pull it out. The good thing about the phrase "Goon Squad tactics" is that it doesn't get lost in the noise like that. Is there another phrase that would work as well without getting lost in the noise?
I don't think it gets lost in the noise for those who are listening. Some won't listen, but I don't think "goon squad" helps lower anyone's hostility.
Would it help if you called it the banana squad? Would you find it offensive if people said you were the head cheer leader for the leftist commandos?
Perhaps the fact that it doesn't get lost in the noise is exactly why you used it. You knew it would offend people and wanted to make them look bad through the reaction. Best plan going forward is to not use general terms for the opponents that are derogatory and be humble and admit you don't have to win every net argument as you can't and after all... https://babylonbee.com/news/man-on-deat ... n-facebook Is that your regret?
Ignoring targeted comments would result in a more peaceful interchange but you likely want to insure someone doesn't believe you believe what they said was true and thats why you respond. Basically, you are allowing yourself to be baited and placing bait back.
Before you go and say "show me where" This has been told to you before about multiple subjects and multiple examples to which you generally either say you don't see anything or dispute the person trying to point out a flaw in you. Its time for self reflection for those who feel like Menno is hostile to see if they actually contribute to the heat or provoke with their words. I'm sure most would agree here that you provoke people which then based off of your responses suggest you either don't intend it and you don't realize how you are coming across, or you are doing it intentionally.
I'm not saying that I hold no guilt, I bait people and respond to bait too.
MaxPC wrote: ↑Wed Jul 07, 2021 9:20 am
Grace, indeed that is calling names in any culture. It certainly does not help the conversation either as it is completely hostile and to those who have been the object of that hostility and expressed it, they are offended. Regarding the person who is disruptive, I do not see any humility by accepting the call of accountability nor in repentance through apology. Rather than this name calling, I advise this person to take a break from the forum and reflect on how better to be a peaceful participant. I like these verses: Galatians 5:22-23
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.
Jesus rebuked; some heeded that rebuke. I think it's always good to hear what several others are pointing out and to reflect.
Using the word "goon squad" as noun would be name calling. But I don't think Boostrap was using the word as a noun, but as an adjective describing certain threads. But he can speak for himself. Let's make sure we don't interject or purport something that wasn't said.
Boot claimed MN has a goon squad out to get Beth Moore, which is farcical. Beth Moore has much more money and power than any of us here. I doubt she has any idea who any of us even are. And, generally speaking, nobody outside of MN is listening much to what people on MN are saying.
The reality is that Boot, and others like him, seem to want to censor and silence any criticism of theological liberals like Beth Moore. For Boot to be happy, MN has to become a theologically liberal discussion board with strict rules for censorship in place to keep anyone conservative out.
