Today at the gun shop:

[Robert]

What is the difference between the US and all those other countries? Mostly the gun laws.

It's not the video games that cause gun violence, it's the guns.

Its not me eating the donut, it is the donut's fault.

[temporal1]

I think there is some correlation, and could be some causation. I have felt this for a while. There have been some recent studies that tend to disprove this. I have not really looked at them hard, so not sure how to consider them.

I do think that the political tones are part of it. The politicians that can convince everyone that the sky is falling and we are in a crisis while things are going well are part of the problem too. Much of the internal mass killings have political overtones. Politicians have to convince the populace that the other guy is doing bad or they will not get a vote. Who wants to vote against the guy doing good? So we are inundated with negative ads constantly.

It convinces the weak minded that we are in a crisis even when we are not.
The imbalanced overreact to the overreaction and we get violence, and the rest find a higher level of dissatisfaction creating a less happy culture.

Do you know most of the gun sales happening now are women and minorities?
Maybe they feel less safe right now as policing is being restricted.

Similar to hollywood’s success even during The Great Depression, video games are big business, regardless of high unemployment, poor economies - and this pandemic. Reports are going to be strongly protective of and supportive, lobbies, money are invested to assure it. i would guess video games+technology enjoy a nice percentage coming from stimulus checks. employment security for big business.

i have a close family member employed in video games. he loves his work.
he is a responsible moral person who rejects the Christianity he was raised with, probably true of most of his peers. (the typical result of today’s higher ed.) they believe their great sense of morality is something they spontaneously created on their own.

they were well employed throughout the 2008 bank failures, and continuing, without a lapse for any reason.

it’s unlikely the public will ever receive any balanced “official” information on cause+effect. these folks are smart, well educated, comfortable, and well-versed in how to legally protect their employment and interests. altho they create violent fantasies for profit, they are personally peaceful and law-abiding, or they would be unemployed. they are nice guys. products of today’s world.

scriptures are useful in warning about cause+effect. the world is not.

when shopping, i now often see young children in grocery carts staring at games on smartphones, oblivious to the world around them. years ago, i became accustomed to young children ignoring me, or having a “deer staring into headlights” look as i passed, they have been trained for “stranger danger,” etc. (this even happens when i’m on walks around my small remote neighborhood!) it feels like an episode in The Twilight Zone. the small children appear drugged; i believe they are just trained to be restrained+detached.

staring at video games instead of living starts young.

but, reports assure, “no downside.” no cost. no cause+effect. (i.e., no interfering with profits!)

[ohio jones]

Its not me eating the donut, it is the donut's fault.

Person A is addicted to playing Donut Pacman, where the hole point of the game is to earn points by gobbling up donuts.

Person B takes a donut safety education class, where she learns that donuts can be dangerous if not used carefully.

They both stop at Dunkin every morning. One of them has a donut and coffee, and lives a long, healthy life. The other one overeats, develops obesity and diabetes, and becomes a burden on his family and society because of his poor health.

We should outlaw Dunkin.

[RZehr]

Maybe shooting people should be outlawed.

[JimFoxvog]

Maybe shooting people should be outlawed.

And the guns designed specifically for shooting people such as handguns, assault rifles, or anything that will fire more than 6 rounds in rapid-fire.

[Ken]

Not really. Not in other modern countries. None of them are remotely close to the US in terms of murder rates. Sure if you count dysfunctional countries like Afghanistan, Somalia, and Honduras you will find high rates. But not if you look at peer countries to the US: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... icide_rate

Murder rates per 100,000

US: 4..96
Canada: 1.76
Germany: 0.95
UK: 1.20
France: 1.20
Australia: 0.89
Japan: 0.26
New Zealand: 0.70
Norway: 0.47
Netherlands: 0.59
Singapore: 0.16
Italy: 0.57
South Korea: 0.60

etc. etc.

What is the difference between the US and all those other countries? Mostly the gun laws.

Interesting editing there. Here is a shot from your site. It shows the US in 94th place out of 220. Many of the places above and below are inconsistent with guns ownership. Turkey and Eygpt are both below the US. They have armed private militias.

I'm talking about PEER countries to the US which are the modern western democracies in Europe and Asia.

If you standard of comparison is Somalia, Sudan or Pakistan then yes, the US doesn't look that bad.

[Ken]

What is the difference between the US and all those other countries? Mostly the gun laws.

It's not the video games that cause gun violence, it's the guns.

Its not me eating the donut, it is the donut's fault.

Lax or non-existent gun laws lead more guns in the hands of irresponsible people. That's not remotely controversial or contradictory. The crazy deranged individual who just shot and killed 10 people in Boulder CO walked into a gun shop and bought this weapon 6 days before his rampage despite having both a criminal record and a record of psychological troubles. That would not have happened in any other modern western democracy

[Sudsy]

What is the difference between the US and all those other countries? Mostly the gun laws.

It's not the video games that cause gun violence, it's the guns.

Its not me eating the donut, it is the donut's fault.

Lax or non-existent gun laws lead more guns in the hands of irresponsible people. That's not remotely controversial or contradictory. The crazy deranged individual who just shot and killed 10 people in Boulder CO walked into a gun shop and bought this weapon 6 days before his rampage despite having both a criminal record and a record of psychological troubles. That would not have happened in any other modern western democracy

So, we have laws against use of illegal drugs, yet these laws don't stop many from drug use. Just like the days of prohibition, those wanting booze got it. Those coming into the country illegally find a way. I'm curious as to why you believe stronger gun laws is the answer. I would guess it would make things harder to get but like drugs, people find a way to get what they want. And then there is the issue of getting more offenders of these tighter laws and keeping them in jail for long periods.

What would you suggest might work ?

[Ken]

So, we have laws against use of illegal drugs, yet these laws don't stop many from drug use. Just like the days of prohibition, those wanting booze got it. Those coming into the country illegally find a way. I'm curious as to why you believe stronger gun laws is the answer. I would guess it would make things harder to get but like drugs, people find a way to get what they want. And then there is the issue of getting more offenders of these tighter laws and keeping them in jail for long periods.

What would you suggest might work ?

This is not really my area of expertise or interest. But off the top of my head, I would treat firearms like we treat cars.

Require education and exams before people qualify for firearms licenses. Require gun safety best practices of both gun owners and manufacturers. Require liability insurance. Regulate firearms sales the same way we regulate car sales with title transfers and such.

Would that prevent criminals from owning guns? Of course not. But it would make it possible for police to confiscate and destroy all illegally owned guns they encounter. And it would give law enforcement a lot more tools to get guns off the streets. Of course the US is currently knee-deep in a sea of firearms so that sort of thing would take decades. But you have to start somewhere.

This is how most European countries treat firearms. Do I think this will ever happen in the US? No, not really. So I don't waste too much time thinking and worrying about it and have other issues I feel more strongly about. I just object to the notion that we are powerless to reduce gun violence through regulation. Every other civilized country has managed to do that. I just don't think we have the political will to do so here in the US, which is something entirely different.

[Robert]

Every other civilized country has managed to do that.

That is a wide brush, but I get your point. I would suggest that there are some underlaying issues that may not reduce violence by strong regulation of guns. We already have regulation of guns. It is illegal for someone to shot another except in self defense. SO anyone who kills another in an act of violence is already breaking the law. I do not think strong regulation of guns will change hearts, just modes of murder. This is the point I am trying to get to.