The Collapse of America

[Robert]

I teach HS students and constantly encounter a lot of highly motivated and amazing kids doing far more than I ever recall kids doing decades ago when I was that age.

Are they good people or practicing followers of Jesus serving others and drawing people to Christ with their words and actions?

If they are just being good people, I would consider that spiritual decline and decay. It doesn't mean the kids are evil, but that the US society has, or is loosing a key part of the foundation it was created with. This means that it has aged and it no longer vibrant and impacting the world for the right reasons. The end does not justify the means. Unless this stops, it will bring collapse of the US foundations and culture to be replaced by legalism and socialism. This would be a collapse in my opinion.

[Ernie]

I agree with the OP in these particular matters.
1. A moral collapse has been happening in the West for a long time. (The moral collapse of Rome was already happening in AD 50. By 200 AD, the morals were much worse.)
2. Anytime an empire messes with gender and family structures, it is only a matter of time until a civilization with a more foundational structure will replace it.
3. Respect for other people is one foundational principle. This year I have been teaching about the coming and going of empires in eastern Asia, and this point is obvious in all of these stories from the past. Whenever greed and disrespect are in control, the society collapses. Interestingly, liberals in the late 20th century promoted tolerance and I think that was good for a society. But the younger generation of liberals tend to be intolerant of others.

I agree with Ken that some metrics are much better now than in the past.

[temporal1]

Grace:
I wasn’t talking about right wing media, but was talking about mainstream media, such as CNN, MSNBC, NY Times, etc. These outlets are no more than propaganda arms of the Democrat party. I could give many examples of their lies purported in the last four years, lies that undermines everything our nation is about.

boot:
I get much of my news from the New York Times. ..

Addressing Grace,
The ignored reality in these types of statements is, no one has to “seek out” mainstream media, it’s virtually impossible to avoid it. In former times, there was a status+snobbery aspect to reading the NYT, WSJ, etc. It was encouraged and taught in school. Beyond question.

Today, it’s the entirety of what is taught in gov schools, Pre-K through college. Thus, to bring examples to this forum is redundant. Bringing them pridefully as if others aren’t aware is .. nonsensical.

It’s troublesome how many on this forum are such loyalists. Jesus would be thrilled to enjoy such honor.

The fact that NOW THE CORRUPT MAINSTREAM feels secure they successfully railroaded a pretty good president, they now have the freedom to report on (Cuomo, the border, etc.) - ‘cause, the “1 party pretending to be 2” CAREER POLITICIANS
feel pretty secure. Their main job is done. Now, the loyalists can freely gulp the lib propaganda, pat one another on their backs, and continue the downward slide, unimpeded.

Grace,
i’m not sure how anyone concludes you follow Fox, or any particular source. i find such accusations intellectually lazy and unfounded. i do not follow Fox. i don’t find what i see there as being any less “inclusive” of varied topics than the NYT or WSJ, etc. i sense intellectual snobbery. and, it’s nothing new in time. it was well entrenched when i was a child.

probably another pot+kettle thing. no. bullies.

[temporal1]

March 26

Sudsy:
But back to the treatment of pets like children as l see the unofficial forum police are trying to keep us 'on topic' . :lol

April 1

Sudsy:
Hey, getting into politics again. Wrong forum !

To clarify, my post (directed to OP steve, Furbabies) was only meant as admiration for him that his thread stayed on topic for 2 pages. Frequently threads are derailed with the-first-response! i had no intent of interfering, just remarking.
to steve.

[temporal1]

I teach HS students and constantly encounter a lot of highly motivated and amazing kids doing far more than I ever recall kids doing decades ago when I was that age.

Are they good people or practicing followers of Jesus serving others and drawing people to Christ with their words and actions?

If they are just being good people, I would consider that spiritual decline and decay.

It doesn't mean the kids are evil, but that the US society has, or is loosing a key part of the foundation it was created with.

This means that it has aged and it no longer vibrant and impacting the world for the right reasons.

The end does not justify the means.

Unless this stops, it will bring collapse of the US foundations and culture to be replaced by legalism and socialism.
This would be a collapse in my opinion.

Ken,
i’m sorry about your younger years and ed experience.

One of The Great Miracles of God’s design, in my view, is, how every newborn, every child and teen and young person, from ages back, have been so very similar. They represent newness, hope, life. Their composition and needs are unchanged.
It was experiencing my first grandchild with her nervous new parents that really “drove this realization home” for me.

At the time, we had a young university student friend working on a double doctorate, brain studies, she moved onto brain surgery before she graduated. i remember asking her about how human brains have changed, and not, over the ages.
my layman’s takeaway was, they haven’t.

Your description of students you have the privilege of interacting with today, matches my experience, my peers’, others’ i’ve witnessed, my children’s, and now my granddaughter’s. i feel sorry for you. i’m glad you’re in a better place now.

Robert.
Well said.

Children+teens, young people, are handicapped due to hyper-strict rules regarding “respecting others’ faith beliefs” while theirs, if Christian, or interested in Christianity, is restricted (at best) if not criticized, ridiculed, dismissed, etc.
As public policy, i.e., by force of the sword. My grdaughter swims in this world.

Separation of church from state was not intended to be interpreted as “strict rule by atheists/humanists,” etc.
Freedom OF religion, not the currently popularized, freedom/protection from it.

The U.S. has aged, a little. Not much wisdom or maturity. It may or may not survive adolescence.
Not all survive.

“IN NAME ONLY”
Interesting words. In my understanding, this is when an entity of some type establishes a good reputation, however, over time, they lose their way. They keep the valuable LABEL, altho the spirit+substance are gone.

Example: BSA. Boy Scouts of America
A popular and trusted scouting group for boys and their families.
Now a big corporation controlled by adults, with adult visions, political lobbies, etc.

In my mind, BSA died (collapsed) in 2014 when the hierarchy chose to ignore boys’+families’ wishes for lib PC goals.
BSA is troubled. Supported by corporations (and gov is involved, i’m confident).
BSA is wealthy, of itself.

So, altho BSA is not what it originally was, the original has died, the label and the outward appearance carry on.
IN NAME ONLY. One example of MANY.

LABELS ARE VALUABLE. Keep the label, cheapen or altogether replace the contents. Pretend it’s original.

For those who care enough to think it through, deceit can be recognized.

“The end justifies the means” is not of Jesus Christ.

[Ken]

Ken,
i’m sorry about your younger years and ed experience.

One of The Great Miracles of God’s design, in my view, is, how every newborn, every child and teen and young person, from ages back, have been so very similar. They represent newness, hope, life. Their composition and needs are unchanged.
It was experiencing my first grandchild with her nervous new parents that really “drove this realization home” for me.

At the time, we had a young university student friend working on a double doctorate, brain studies, she moved onto brain surgery before she graduated. i remember asking her about how human brains have changed, and not, over the ages.
my layman’s takeaway was, they haven’t.

Your description of students you have the privilege of interacting with today, matches my experience, my peers’, others’ i’ve witnessed, my children’s, and now my granddaughter’s. i feel sorry for you. i’m glad you’re in a better place now.

My younger years were fine. I had a good group of friends who have gone on to do lots of good things. Same as all of us who are middle aged and beyond. But the fact is that kids today are higher achieving and more moral than they were decades go by just about any measure you want to use: Drug and alcohol use, teen pregnancy, violent crime, test scores, academic achievement, college attendance, respect for authority, etc. etc. Some are very religious. some aren't. Just like always. It's not all doom and gloom.

The country is also changing rapidly and just like there will be geographic winners and losers, there will be socioeconomic winners and losers. But that's the way it has always been too. Out here in the west many rural areas are littered with ghost towns and the remnants of whole communities and entire industries that have literally vanished and were blown away like tumbleweeds by the changing economies of previous generations. People mostly moved on and found new opportunities. That seems to happen much less in the east where unproductive towns and farms and such linger for generation after generation if not centuries. Probably because the population is so much more dense and a lot of those places just become outer-edge suburbia.

[temporal1]

“doom and gloom” are your words, evidently intended to dismiss and belittle others. not constructive.
of course, several times, you have shared your amusement at others’ obvious ignorance; it’s a pleasure for you. you invest in it. not uncommon.

i’m appreciative of RZehr and others sharing about their observations, experiences, and even warnings.
“to be forewarned” .. is to be prepared. scriptures help a lot with that. Jesus offers Himself.

Jesus is not doom and gloom. He is hope.

[Grace]

temporal1

Addressing Grace,
The ignored reality in these types of statements is, no one has to “seek out” mainstream media, it’s virtually impossible to avoid it. In former times, there was a status+snobbery aspect to reading the NYT, WSJ, etc. It was encouraged and taught in school. Beyond question.

Today, it’s the entirety of what is taught in gov schools, Pre-K through college. Thus, to bring examples to this forum is redundant. Bringing them pridefully as if others aren’t aware is .. nonsensical.

It’s troublesome how many on this forum are such loyalists. Jesus would be thrilled to enjoy such honor.

The fact that NOW THE CORRUPT MAINSTREAM feels secure they successfully railroaded a pretty good president, they now have the freedom to report on (Cuomo, the border, etc.) - ‘cause, the “1 party pretending to be 2” CAREER POLITICIANS
feel pretty secure. Their main job is done. Now, the loyalists can freely gulp the lib propaganda, pat one another on their backs, and continue the downward slide, unimpeded.

Agreed. I could give you many examples where main steam media outlets took the words of Trump and others out of context and changed the whole gist of the story.

When Trump said that the United States immigration laws are the most lax in the world (And they are) and those lax are the laughingstock of the world, the main stream media claimed Trump said “Our nation the laughingstock of the whole world". Trump was talking about our lax border security, not that the whole nation is a laughingstock.

After the shootings in Pittsburgh, the main stream media reported that the Pittsburgh Rabbi didn’t want the President to visit.
But it was a lie, Rabbi asked that President Trump wait until the funerals of the shooting victims are done and then he would be welcome.

In Charlottesville there were protests between White Supremacists and BLM costing the life of a woman. The protests were over the removal of a statue. Some of the protestors wanted it to stay, others did not. Trump said there were good people on both sides of the issue pertaining to the removal of the statue. Main stream media twisted the story and said that there were good people on both sides of the BLM groups and the White Supremacists. It was a lie that still is purported today by the media.

Of course the biggest lie was that Trump colluded with Russia.

Grace,
i’m not sure how anyone concludes you follow Fox, or any particular source. i find such accusations intellectually lazy and unfounded. i do not follow Fox. i don’t find what i see there as being any less “inclusive” of varied topics than the NYT or WSJ, etc. i sense intellectual snobbery. and, it’s nothing new in time. it was well entrenched when i was a child.

probably another pot+kettle thing. no. bullies.

We don't have TV, so my news sources vary. The Blaze, Mediaite, Gateway Pundit, Daily mail, etc. Sometimes I watch small news clips from Fox on You Tube, but might also watch news clips from other outlets. I like to get my sources from the actual people, such watching the press briefings. Although those are sooooo painful to listen to as Jen Psaki simply can't speak beyond a Junior High level, with hundreds of ahs-ums-errs- well as you know-I will circle back, ad nauseam. And if that isn't bad enough, the lies are disgusting. Yesterday's briefing she out and out lied about the new Georgia voter laws. But what do you expect? She works for an administration that promotes evil.

Biden's is responsible for the border surge of children from Latin America. When he announced that unaccompanied minors will be admitted into the United States, he upped the evil opportunities of the ruthless and brutal human smugglers to exploit children. Throwing little children over the wall, dropping babies in rivers, leaving them to drown and that is just a fraction. A percentage of the young girls are sexually assaulted or worse yet, raped by their smugglers.

One thing we do know is that Biden will up the pace of the moral collapse of America. One has to wonder how long the Lord will look the other way.

[RZehr]

I expect this next 12-36 months we will experience a economic boom, the likes of which haven’t been seen in a generation.

[Robert]

I get much of my news from the New York Times.

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news ... n-headline

The New York Times is being slammed over a headline describing President Joe Biden’s $2 trillion infrastructure spending plan.

"BIDEN PLAN STRESSES JOBS, ROADS AND GROWTH,” the headline published by the paper on Thursday read above an article outlining the president’s recent spending push.

BIDEN CALLED MCCONNELL ABOUT $2 TRILLION INFRASTRUCTURE PLAN AFTER WEEKS OF SILENCE

“Brazen, cartoonish, straight-up propaganda,” Federalist senior editor Mollie Hemingway tweeted in response to the headline. “As if written by White House staff for the most gullible and easily controlled idiots in the country.”

Underlining was mine.