Rapture?

[Outsider]

I just watched an Amish-Mennonite preacher deliver a sermon based on the "rapture" of the true believers before the "tribulations" of Revelations, very much in the "left-behind" style. He uses the term in his sermon.

I personally don't believe in the "left-behind" scenario.

Revelations 11:

3. And to them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power. 4 They were commanded not to harm the grass of the earth, or any green thing, or any tree, but only those men who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads.

This is an example of why. The only place I can see where people are "raptured" is when Christ returns and the faithful in the flesh are called up to meet him in the air.

Are there many people here who believe in the "left-behind" theology?

[Neto]

In the text where Jesus speaks of "one being taken, the other left" it is not clear who will be taken and who left. Those of the theological position you mention assume that text refers to the same event as that to which you refer, the "taking up to meet him in the air". But when the disciples ask "Where?" he answers with a riddle, "Where the dead body is, there the vultures gather." Many take this to mean that those who are "taken" are taken for judgement. In fact, this terminology seems to be most often used in that context, and so contrary to those who associate it with the 'rapture', it may mean the opposite.
But Jesus' answer to the question "Where?" can also be taken in the sense of "Where will this happen?", in which case the answer has a different meaning. In my opinion, it remains a mystery, and as a Bible translator, I found this type of text the most difficult to render accurately, because the goal of the translator is to leave unanswered questions as equally 'mystery' as he or she finds them. (That is not to say that the translator must not search to understand all that is possible to understand, but in cases like this we do not even know if the disciples understood Jesus' answer, or if they even thought they understood.)

[Sudsy]

I was raised Pentecostal and the "left behind" theology was often preached generating considerable fear that if I was involved in some kind of sinning when the rapture takes place, I would be left behind. It also provided a slim hope that following this would be a 7 year tribulation period and I would be living in circumstances that would likely have me killed for repenting of those sins and holding unto my faith.

I remember some pretty scary sermons that suggested if I was doing this or that or was not doing this or that, I would not qualify to be raptured. I could hardly wait for the sermon to end to head to the prayer room and pray that I would be in the rapture. Not much assurance of salvation and certainly not any eternal security belief.

Currently I would say I am a 'panmillennialist' (it will all pan out as God has it planned). I don't live in fear of not being saved even though I do sin (as do every Christian) as Jesus has paid for all my sins past, present and future. I believe Jesus saves to the uttermost for those who fully put their trust in Him.

So, end time theology, to me, should not have much bearing on how I currently live. My next breath may be my last one. That, imo, should be more worthwhile to consider in how I'm being an ambassador for the Kingdom.

[Neto]

.... My next breath may be my last one. That, imo, should be more worthwhile to consider in how I'm being an ambassador for the Kingdom.

Yes. This is the answer to those who, as believers in "the imminent return of Christ", say that if you do NOT hold to this doctrine of theirs, then you will live like the devil, because supposedly you can repent with your last breath. There is an "imminent meeting with Christ", because we could die at any moment. But even then, this particular type of fear is not the kind we should have toward our God. The OT says "With you there is forgiveness, therefore I will fear you". If there were no forgiveness, then there would be no reason to continue to fear God, knowing that we are already doomed without any possible remedy or escape.

[barnhart]

Are there many people here who believe in the "left-behind" theology?

I'm skeptical.

[Outsider]

So, end time theology, to me, should not have much bearing on how I currently live. My next breath may be my last one. That, imo, should be more worthwhile to consider in how I'm being an ambassador for the Kingdom.

Amen to that!

[Valerie]

Are there many people here who believe in the "left-behind" theology?

I'm skeptical.

I believed it cor my first few hears as a Christian, in the 70's. Im not of Anabaptist background, but it was widely taught during yhe Jesus Movement.

It spread greatly because of the Schofield Bible, which had reinterpreted the entire Bible and was contrary to way that church had taught interpretation and prophecies and in times for the first 1800 years before the the rapture theory came out. Having learned the historical viewpoint of the church and how the rapture theory was birthed in 1800s and from whence it came it helped me to see the error of it.

I'm surprised to hear of an Amish Mennonite Pastor that's preaching it

[Neto]

It is true that the word 'rapture' does not occur in the KJV (and maybe not in other translations as well), and while I would agree that the the common doctrinal representation of it (as in pre-trib) isn't supported by Scripture, the Bible DOES teach that both the living & the dead will be caught up to meet the Christ in the air. How do you all understand the word 'rapture' to differ with that? (I should have asked at the beginning for your definition.)

[Outsider]

It is true that the word 'rapture' does not occur in the KJV (and maybe not in other translations as well), and while I would agree that the the common doctrinal representation of it (as in pre-trib) isn't supported by Scripture, the Bible DOES teach that both the living & the dead will be caught up to meet the Christ in the air. How do you all understand the word 'rapture' to differ with that? (I should have asked at the beginning for your definition.)

Yes, that would be my opinion as well. "Rapture" is not only one of those words Christians use which isn't from the bible (in allusion to another thread I've read). The very end, and the return of Christ, and after all the dead have risen, is when
the only thing comparable I can find in the scripture.

[Outsider]

It is true that the word 'rapture' does not occur in the KJV (and maybe not in other translations as well), and while I would agree that the the common doctrinal representation of it (as in pre-trib) isn't supported by Scripture, the Bible DOES teach that both the living & the dead will be caught up to meet the Christ in the air. How do you all understand the word 'rapture' to differ with that? (I should have asked at the beginning for your definition.)

Yes, that would be my opinion as well. "Rapture" is one of those words Christians use which isn't from the bible (in allusion to another thread I've read). The very end, and the return of Christ, and after all the dead have risen, is when
the only thing comparable I can find in the scripture.