It’s the Bible that says it, not me. The Bible says that promoting homosexuality is evil.Szdfan wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2026 12:26 pmConsidering that JohnH calls my honest beliefs “evil,” I can tell you it’s not pleasant.ken_sylvania wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2026 10:19 amHow would you feel if JohnH used language like that to describe your honest beliefs?
briar patch
Re: Charlie Kirk Shot
2 x
Re: Charlie Kirk Shot
So when you condemn my beliefs, that’s just faithfully applying Scripture. But when I criticize your behavior, that’s an unfair personal attack. I think that’s a glaring double standard.JohnH wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2026 1:47 amIt’s the Bible that says it, not me. The Bible says that promoting homosexuality is evil.Szdfan wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2026 12:26 pmConsidering that JohnH calls my honest beliefs “evil,” I can tell you it’s not pleasant.ken_sylvania wrote: ↑Tue Jun 23, 2026 10:19 am
How would you feel if JohnH used language like that to describe your honest beliefs?
What I find frustrating about interacting with you is that you insist we treat your feelings with extreme tenderness. You accused me of lying when I described you as a “Trump supporter,” even though you’ve written thousands of posts over the past decade defending him. Yet you can call my sincerely held beliefs evil and lecture me about my motivations, political loyalties, and how I’m captured by liberal ideology.
I understand that you believe Scripture requires you to call some beliefs sinful. That’s not the issue. My issue is that you routinely tell other people what they believe and why they believe it, while objecting when others do it to you.
I find that asymmetry deeply hypocritical.
0 x
"Woe to those who make unjust laws, to those who issue oppressive decrees, to deprive the poor of their rights and withhold justice from the oppressed of my people, making widows their prey and robbing the fatherless."
-- Isaiah 10:1-2
-- Isaiah 10:1-2
Re: Charlie Kirk Shot
I’m fully aware of your feelings about me and I have been going on decades now.Szdfan wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2026 11:42 amSo when you condemn my beliefs, that’s just faithfully applying Scripture. But when I criticize your behavior, that’s an unfair personal attack. I think that’s a glaring double standard.
What I find frustrating about interacting with you is that you insist we treat your feelings with extreme tenderness. You accused me of lying when I described you as a “Trump supporter,” even though you’ve written thousands of posts over the past decade defending him. Yet you can call my sincerely held beliefs evil and lecture me about my motivations, political loyalties, and how I’m captured by liberal ideology.
I understand that you believe Scripture requires you to call some beliefs sinful. That’s not the issue. My issue is that you routinely tell other people what they believe and why they believe it, while objecting when others do it to you.
I find that asymmetry deeply hypocritical.
0 x
Re: Charlie Kirk Shot
Just treat people the way you want to be treated.JohnH wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2026 11:59 amI’m fully aware of your feelings about me and I have been going on decades now.Szdfan wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2026 11:42 amSo when you condemn my beliefs, that’s just faithfully applying Scripture. But when I criticize your behavior, that’s an unfair personal attack. I think that’s a glaring double standard.
What I find frustrating about interacting with you is that you insist we treat your feelings with extreme tenderness. You accused me of lying when I described you as a “Trump supporter,” even though you’ve written thousands of posts over the past decade defending him. Yet you can call my sincerely held beliefs evil and lecture me about my motivations, political loyalties, and how I’m captured by liberal ideology.
I understand that you believe Scripture requires you to call some beliefs sinful. That’s not the issue. My issue is that you routinely tell other people what they believe and why they believe it, while objecting when others do it to you.
I find that asymmetry deeply hypocritical.
0 x
"Woe to those who make unjust laws, to those who issue oppressive decrees, to deprive the poor of their rights and withhold justice from the oppressed of my people, making widows their prey and robbing the fatherless."
-- Isaiah 10:1-2
-- Isaiah 10:1-2
Re: Charlie Kirk Shot
I would expect to be called out on stuff the Bible teaches against (and I think some people here have felt free to do that).
I have tried hard not to mis-represent your positions or attribute things to you that you don't believe or don't promote. I feel, though, in my arguments with you, that's usually what I'm up against. You've decided I'm some kind of Trump campaign employee and I can't do anything to get you to stop doing that.
0 x
Re: Charlie Kirk Shot
Let me rephrase.
I feel that you have decided I'm some kind of Trump campaign employee, and I can't find any way to change your mind, and that you are on some kind of mission to prove to everyone else that I am. It doesn't matter how many times I disagree with Trump, say I don't like one of his policies, don't believe him, think he is outright being deceptive... nope, I have permanently become the "other" in your mind, the enemy, the person who is the problem, and I can't do anything to change it.
0 x
Re: Charlie Kirk Shot
I’ve never said and I don’t think you’re a Trump campaign employee. That’s your characterization, not mine.JohnH wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2026 12:20 pmI would expect to be called out on stuff the Bible teaches against (and I think some people here have felt free to do that).
I have tried hard not to mis-represent your positions or attribute things to you that you don't believe or don't promote. I feel, though, in my arguments with you, that's usually what I'm up against. You've decided I'm some kind of Trump campaign employee and I can't do anything to get you to stop doing that.
0 x
"Woe to those who make unjust laws, to those who issue oppressive decrees, to deprive the poor of their rights and withhold justice from the oppressed of my people, making widows their prey and robbing the fatherless."
-- Isaiah 10:1-2
-- Isaiah 10:1-2
Re: briar patch
I don’t think you’re the enemy. I don’t think you’re the other. I don’t think you’re the person who is “the problem.” Again, those are your characterizations, not mine.JohnH wrote: ↑Wed Jun 24, 2026 12:31 pm
Let me rephrase.
I feel that you have decided I'm some kind of Trump campaign employee, and I can't find any way to change your mind, and that you are on some kind of mission to prove to everyone else that I am. It doesn't matter how many times I disagree with Trump, say I don't like one of his policies, don't believe him, think he is outright being deceptive... nope, I have permanently become the "other" in your mind, the enemy, the person who is the problem, and I can't do anything to change it.
I do deeply disagree with you. I do object to the language you use that I see as dehumanizing. I do object to conspiracy theories that have their roots in white supremacist groups. I think I should be able to push back on arguments I don’t agree with, just as you do.
But that doesn’t mean I think you’re “mini-Hitler” or a Nazi or a Trump campaign employee. It does mean I think you’re wrong.
0 x
"Woe to those who make unjust laws, to those who issue oppressive decrees, to deprive the poor of their rights and withhold justice from the oppressed of my people, making widows their prey and robbing the fatherless."
-- Isaiah 10:1-2
-- Isaiah 10:1-2
Re: Charlie Kirk Shot
o.there it is.nice.
i’d begun to wonder if this long time policy was to be abandoned.
0 x
i’m perfectly comfortable with an older, wiser, more docile Trump.
”Try hard not to offend. Try harder not to be offended.” Robert Martz
”Try hard not to offend. Try harder not to be offended.” Robert Martz