Bunny Trails

[JohnH]

Wife: I think the phrase comes from Acts 15.

It's Acts 16:4 in the KJV only. No other widely-used translation includes the archaic "for".

It is wonderful to see such an godly heritage preserved.

[Valerie]

So you’ve told us who you don’t think is an American, but you have defined what makes someone an American. What makes you an American?

This has nothing to do with the facts of why this went to the Supreme Court so please don’t start a futile argument.

Neither was John’s assertion that not all American citizens are “real Americans.” That was not the question in front of the court. Since John made that distinction, I think it’s fair to ask him about it.

So then put it in bunny trails. Where it will turn into another 10 pages of arguing but it has nothing to do with the topic

[Szdfan]

This has nothing to do with the facts of why this went to the Supreme Court so please don’t start a futile argument.

Neither was John’s assertion that not all American citizens are “real Americans.” That was not the question in front of the court. Since John made that distinction, I think it’s fair to ask him about it.

So then put it in bunny trails. Where it will turn into another 10 pages of arguing but it has nothing to do with the topic

Then ask the moderators to move it.

[temporal1]

i think it would be good to review the use of the word in question, as used in this thread. feel free to read several pages worth. or the whole thing.

It wouldn’t make any difference. It simply doesn’t work to have this many people flooding the country.

Incidentally the #3 group of illegal aliens by country are Indians. India is a long way from America and it involves either a plane ride or a very long boat ride to get here. Why are so many infesting this country?

justme,

Didn't we have a thread where a few people discussed that, and I agreed it's not good to use it in that context and apologised?

Would you like me to make an apology specifically to you?

Is there something else I need to do to please you with regard to this?

JohnH,
it might be helpful if you added examples of apologies (single or plural) about the word, “infestation”. ??
i think i found at least one example. at one point, you offered to use the word, FLOODING, which i thought was a good idea.

[temporal1]

2026
This 2016 topic has such good content. 2 gems:

I just read this discussion through now. When I read this part of the conversation, I immediately thought of I Timothy 1:15, where Paul says that "The Christ came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am the worst," the prime example. He doesn't say "of whom I WAS the worst", but "AM the worst". Are we uncomfortable with an admission like that?

It does sting to make that admission, and is a good thing to keep in remember.

It doesn't make sense that Paul is saying conclusively that he is worst.
If this is comparatively measurable, then would we be comfortable saying of ourselves "Christ came into the world to save sinners, of whom I am not the worst"? Can I say that Paul was a worse sinner than me?

Neto, I do apologize again and realize that my reply was based on a knee jerk reaction to the improper use (imo) of that passage from I Timothy. It is a common reply from those in "grace alone" groups to excuse the continuing in sin, believing that we are still prone to sin. I believe that idea is a confounding of scripture, which I was mixing with your post. You offered only one side of the coin, without further explanation, to which I reacted.
I am sorry and hope you will forgive me.
Baptists and Lutherans would mitigate against my understanding and see Anabaptist teaching as being legalism, as well as that of the Holiness people. As for the Holiness people, it was well intended and sincerely believed that the sin nature could be totally eradicated with the second work of grace, ie, an infilling of the Holy Spirit. It did leave a few people in hospital care who could not attain and lost their mental stability in the process, always striving but never actually measuring up.

BTW, I disagree with your take on the rapture/second coming.

Thank you for your kind words. Reconciliation is what I desire. I agree that that verse is often misused, just like the quote from Jesus “Judge not, lest you be judged.” (Ha. That would a topic for discussion, maybe. What is the most misused verse in Scripture?) But I only mentioned one side, because the other side was already well represented, and I didn’t have a lot of time right then. (Perhaps I should not post at all under those circumstances, but I tend to get long-winded when I do take the time, so there you have it. ) I don’t disbelieve one, and hold to the other. Both verses are Scripture, and both are true. You expressed well my own reason for posting the verse I did – that people who are genuinely seeking to live in holiness not loose heart when/if they do fail, feeling that they can never attain to the goal, so just deciding that it was no use. But that can really amount to a sort of legalism, because that thinking is based to some degree on the idea that I have to earn God’s approval, and we can never do that (in the sense of earning salvation).
About being called a ‘legalist’. I got so tired of being called that, and being the object of ‘special prayer’ that I finally started just telling people right off that I was a legalist. I’d say, Hi, I’m Ernie, and I’m a legalist. (For anyone that doesn’t know, my legal name is Ernest, and I’ve gone by Ernie for much of my life in the States, after I was 20 or so. Neto is my Indian nick-name.)

Anyway, that would really put them off guard, and so they would start asking a lot of questions, and end up arguing with me. It was easier to let them convince me that I was not a legalist than for me to convince them that I was not. They seemed to listen better.

Second work of grace.
I went to Bible college in a Christian & Missionary Alliance school, so I was taught about this, and healing in the atonement, etc. I do believe in a 2nd work of Grace, and a 3rd work of Grace, and a 4th ….
Rapture. While I don’t agree with your understand of this, either, I do respect it, because I see it as a possible understanding of the Scripture.

[temporal1]

I’m not a fan as I real appreciate _******_ and his well known ministry, discernment, and a husband & father I admire greatly so I cannot fathom accusations that he’s as she claims in all this. It’s ridiculous to use Facebook in this way-

This is the type of thinking that allows abuse to continue - no matter whose name is in the blank. There have been plenty of powerful men who continued to abuse their power because nobody imagined they were capable of doing the wrong things they were doing behind closed doors.

It’s a universal problem, not in churches, alone, everywhere. Including law enforcement. No slam-dunks.

i once had a small job with a small (but wealthy) family business. our children were friends.
i was regularly in+out of their shop. everything was peachy.

until, news reports of lurid accusations, then ugly vandalism at the shop. (not children)
i didn’t believe any of it for one moment. i was sure it was all a mistake.
i ignored everything, kept working.

time passed. things settled. their marriage was intact. it was over.
i’d never mentioned a word about any of it to anyone. i was sure it was a mistake.

one day.
the owner asked me to sit down in his office. ok. ?
he began by apologizing, “i owe you an apology”. no. i said, no, you don’t.
i assured him i never believed anything i heard/saw.

he said, “it was all true, AND worse than what you saw”.
i was in shock. i couldn’t believe it. not possible.

he wasn’t joking.
he described how his wife’s faith saved him, WITH DEDICATED EFFORT, he was able to get through it, to face it, to get past it.
i knew his wife. and young daughter. 2 beautiful ones.

i believed it and accepted his apology.

his retail business survived. i’m sure it was damaged, but it went on.
children were not involved.

other important responsible men in the community were involved. i didn’tknow them personally.
probably the country club set. i didn’t pursue.

years have passed. the family-generations shop is recently closed. i know of no other incidents.
their daughter is teaching out of state. after college she didn’t return home to live.

SIN hurts with a ripple effect that harms well beyond the initial act. a unversal fact.

Many prominent people have skeletons in their closets.
That being said, a wrongful accusation by a female will destroy a man's life.

[temporal1]

For reference; this may be AI.

copilot
Registered offender lists provide public access to information about individuals convicted of certain sex offenses, including their location, risk level, and registration status.
National Registry Access
The Dru Sjodin National Sex Offender Public Website (NSOPW) allows users to search for registered sex offenders across all 50 states, U.S. territories, and Indian Country. It consolidates information from state, tribal, and territorial registries into a single searchable database, providing details such as offender names, addresses, and risk levels. NSOPW is managed by the U.S. Department of Justice under the Adam Walsh Child Protection and Safety Act, ensuring standardized registration and notification procedures nationwide (FBI,
.
State and Local Registries
Each state maintains its own registry with specific rules for registration and public disclosure. For example, in Washington State, offenders are classified into three levels based on risk of reoffending:

Level I: Low risk, not publicly listed
Level II: Moderate risk, publicly listed
Level III: High risk, publicly listed

Adult offenders may be required to register for life, 15 years, or 10 years depending on the severity of the offense, while juveniles have shorter registration periods (2–3 years) depending on age and offense type. Restrictions on residency, proximity to children, curfews, and substance use may apply if the offender is under supervision (Washington Association of Sheriffs and Police Chiefs)
waspc.org
.
Local city-specific registries, such as for Port Angeles, Washington, provide information on the number of registered offenders in the area, their addresses, and ratios relative to the population. These lists are intended for public safety and should not be used to harass or intimidate individuals (City-Data)
City-Data.com
.
Interactive Tools
Websites like offenders.io offer interactive maps to locate registered offenders by address, city, or ZIP code. These tools provide real-time registry data and are useful for personal awareness, community safety, and professional compliance purposes
offenders.io
.
Important Considerations
Not all offenders are publicly listed; Level I offenders or those under certain legal restrictions may not appear.
Misuse of registry information to threaten or harass individuals is illegal.
For the most accurate and comprehensive information, consult both national and state registries.
By using these resources, individuals can access reliable information about registered offenders in their community or nationwide, supporting informed decisions for personal and public safety.

Presently, there are tremendous measures taken to protect offenders and their rights in all matters.
The legal system is tested to its maximum limits.

According to the level of offense, my understanding is, it would be illegal for some offenders to be present in spaces where (children, the vulnerable) would be. ?? Recognizing and enforcing are the questions.

The legal system isn’t flawless.

Of course victims feel injustice. Even rage.
Healthy, responsible leaders are hard-challenged to navigate the mess SINS+CRIMES create.

No easy feat.

The sheer numbers of registered offenders boggles the mind. Along with their seemingly endless locations.

[temporal1]

Hindsight is 20/20

praying for Grace to have a good outcome from this.
God provides His way for all those seeking.

often, the most difficult situations open unexpected doors.

[temporal1]

i’m happy my vision problems don’t seem to be noticed. i really like that.

one of the things i noticed about the internet (early on MD) was how it allowed (equal) expression for people who would otherwise be quite removed from others - no matter age. one young man in his 20’s, suffering chronic pain, found an outlet on MD - where no one noticed he was in bed most of the time. i wish he was still active on forum. i believe he left after the volunteer forum police irritated him once too often. i was sad.

the internet can effortlessly level the playing field for lots of people. if they can stand it.

good news,
the young man’s mother found a special diet that relieved a lot of his pain.
i think lesterb had that diagnosis? Ankylosing Spondylitis

[temporal1]

P.4:

The leadership knew about this when they hired Leroy. ..

The #1 problem, no matter setting.
The abusers deny and blame victims, the enablers get sucked in.

It’s all very difficult, no overstating how difficult+painful the ripple effect of sin makes things.

Neto:
.. Here's something about a case where one congregation sent letters to other congregations within the same denomination about a woman who was excommunicated for unrepentant immorality. But since it was between 'consenting adults' it was not illegal in the eye of the civil government. She sued the church for defamation of character, won, and was awarded such a sum that the small congregation was forced to close, and declare bankruptcy. (This happened back in the small town close to where I grew up in Oklahoma; in the 70's, as I recall now.)

Fear of litigation is HUGE.
Fear of “making everything worse” is another.
Fear of CPS making everything worse is another.

i wish the dynamics of why these sins fester and even grow would be dealt with.
i think lots of people get caught up in it who are not at all evil.
often suffering in silence, not knowing what to do. (emphasis on suffering.)

.. Grace likely is her real name but posts like this underscore the reason not to be public.
The chance of public threats just for addressing a public figure is kind of the same issue that she addresses about leadership in these circles.

Fear of social media .. mob mentality ..

^^All these things and more directly aid offenders, usually the opposite of what is wanted/intended.
SIN is thoroughly insidious.