silentreader wrote: ↑Sat Aug 03, 2024 10:56 am
If you don't "exegete" and "practice" in "that paradigm" then you should be able to answer a simple question with a simple answer.
And I do actually wonder why you won't.
Because it's a loaded question. What are you really trying to ask?
It has become loaded only because you won't answer it.
We have gone far enough with this. It is evident there is no profitable outcome. Carry on.
silentreader wrote: ↑Sat Aug 03, 2024 11:49 amWhat did Abraham say? (Not necessarily exact wording) "If they believed not Moses and the prophets, how will they believe if one came back from the dead?" How does that factor in?
Those who had the oracles of God committed to them are responsible to believe and repent and obey. I believe this was true in the OT and the NT.
Are you remembering that I said this originally?
If a person refuses to believe that Jesus died, was buried, and rose again, I don't expect such a person to have eternal life.
silentreader wrote: ↑Sat Aug 03, 2024 11:49 am
Or Paul in Romans 1:18-20 (CSB)
18 For God’s wrath is revealed from heaven against all godlessness and unrighteousness of people who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth, 19 since what can be known about God is evident among them, because God has shown it to them. 20 For his invisible attributes, that is, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen since the creation of the world, being understood through what he has made. As a result, people are without excuse.
Anyone who rejects God, or refuses to hear him, or resists his Spirit cannot claim to be innocent and cannot hope for further opportunity!
The Hebrew writer says,
today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts as in the rebellion.
Today is the day of salvation. If God is speaking to you (whether through Creation, Gospel preaching, still small voice, or an angel) listen up! Do not harden your hearts!
It is my impression that I believe this is more far reaching than you do, considering people groups with no Bible teaching who still have, for instance, a creation "myth" or a flood "myth". How accountable are they to that "knowledge" according to Romans? I don't know.
Isaiah 30:15-16
For thus says the Lord God, the Holy One of Israel:
“In returning and rest you shall be saved;
In quietness and confidence shall be your strength.”
But you would not,
And you said, “No, for we will flee on horses”—
Therefore you shall flee!
And, “We will ride on swift horses”—
Therefore those who pursue you shall be swift!
I understand God to be saying, "If you try getting away from me, I will send swift horses after you. Don't think you can get away from me!"
Ernie wrote: ↑Sat Aug 03, 2024 12:13 pm
There is so much in the Bible that is painfully easy to understand. It is very clear what we should be thinking, what we should be believing, and what we should be doing.
Yet it seems that so many people (including preachers) like to clarify and solidify doctrines about the spiritual world and the afterlife that we only have very limited knowledge about. Let God be true and every man a liar.
Yes, I also believe in a plain reading of Scripture, comparing it with other Scripture. But in order for that to work we must first lay aside preconceptions.
silentreader wrote: ↑Sat Aug 03, 2024 10:56 am
If you don't "exegete" and "practice" in "that paradigm" then you should be able to answer a simple question with a simple answer.
And I do actually wonder why you won't.
Because it's a loaded question. What are you really trying to ask?
It has become loaded only because you won't answer it.
We have gone far enough with this. It is evident there is no profitable outcome. Carry on.
I did give you an answer. I said I think Jesus can save people in any way he wishes, including people who don't quite have all the "right" beliefs to check your boxes.