Why are Christian businesses targeted .....

[RZehr]

Here's an actual example of a business being targeted by a mob. Today actually. Because of the religious beliefs of the owners. Let me know when something similar happens to Christians.

Berlin, 1935

[Bootstrap]

To me, a lot of threads have an attitude I consider counterproductive. Christians are foreign to the world. We should not be surprised or outraged when they don't get us. And we shouldn't exaggerate the level of persecution we actually face in this country or promote fear.

Early Christians, Christians in other countries, and early Anabaptists all faced levels of persecution that we simply do not. And how did they respond to it? We should follow their example. Which is the same as following the example of Jesus.

And that's simply not what most of these threads are about. Christianity is not a political special interest group. If the world doesn't get us, that's no surprise. But our main focus should be on how we live our lives as disciples and how we reach out to a lost and hurting world.

[Ken]

Could you explain to us why Masterpiece Cakeshop has been targeted multiple times? (Not to mention a literal pizza delivery place in Indiana - as if gay people seriously would cater a wedding with pizzas.)

Multiple times? There is one case from 2012 and another case from 2017. Those are the only cases I can find. Do you have anything from this decade?

There are literally thousands of bakeries across the country. If Christian bakers are actually being persecuted for their faith you would think that you could find a case from this decade, no?

And not have to make up cases out of thin air such as was the case with Lorie Smith.

There’s a currently active case relating to a “transgender themed” cake request. I found it in 15 seconds with a lazy Google search.

That was the case from 2017.

Masterpiece Cake Shop is continuing to appeal and the Colorado Supreme Court finally agreed to hear the case. They are choosing to continue the appeal. No one is dragging them into court. Not the original complainers and not the State. The matter was actually settled years ago. And the event in question happened nearly 7 years ago. Do you have something from this decade?

[Josh]

That was the case from 2017.

Masterpiece Cake Shop is continuing to appeal and the Colorado Supreme Court finally agreed to hear the case. They are choosing to continue the appeal. No one is dragging them into court. Not the original complainers and not the State. The matter was actually settled years ago. And the event in question happened nearly 7 years ago. Do you have something from this decade?

No, the case isn't over - they're continuing the process because otherwise they'll be a sitting duck for the next activist that decides to call up and order a cake solely so they can take them to court.

Does anyone seriously assert that homosexuals and transsexuals are unable to access the American market of goods and services to obtain decorated cakes? If not, then why target the (very rare) Christian business that doesn't want to write such messages on cakes?

[Bootstrap]

I agree with you Ken, the actual examples are extremely thin. My thoughts are turned to how believers are responding.

We can decide to be part of the political outrage machine. Or we can decide to seek first the Kingdom of God.

I don't think we can do both at the same time. Often, the Kingdom of God doesn't seem to be the loudest voice in the room. And I think that is more of a threat than anything involving wedding cakes.

[Ken]

That was the case from 2017.

Masterpiece Cake Shop is continuing to appeal and the Colorado Supreme Court finally agreed to hear the case. They are choosing to continue the appeal. No one is dragging them into court. Not the original complainers and not the State. The matter was actually settled years ago. And the event in question happened nearly 7 years ago. Do you have something from this decade?

No, the case isn't over - they're continuing the process because otherwise they'll be a sitting duck for the next activist that decides to call up and order a cake solely so they can take them to court.

Does anyone seriously assert that homosexuals and transsexuals are unable to access the American market of goods and services to obtain decorated cakes? If not, then why target the (very rare) Christian business that doesn't want to write such messages on cakes?

Like I said. Your example is from 2017. If Christian businesses were as commonly targeted as Jewish and Muslim businesses then you would surely have hundreds of examples to point to that are more recent than 7 years old.

[Josh]

Like I said. Your example is from 2017. If Christian businesses were as commonly targeted as Jewish and Muslim businesses then you would surely have hundreds of examples to point to that are more recent than 7 years old.

Could you answer my question about who, exactly, is "targeting" all these Jewish or Muslim businesses? (And you haven't posted much evidence of Muslim businesses being targeted actually.)

[GaryK]

I agree with you Ken, the actual examples are extremely thin. My thoughts are turned to how believers are responding.

We can decide to be part of the political outrage machine. Or we can decide to seek first the Kingdom of God.

I don't think we can do both at the same time. Often, the Kingdom of God doesn't seem to be the loudest voice in the room. And I think that is more of a threat than anything involving wedding cakes.

Politics has always been an outrage machine and always will be. I remember as a youngster noting the bashing of the other side that took place in every election. That's the nature of politics.

I have a simple question for you. Is your well documented dislike of Trump and MAGA Republicans part of the political outrage machine or is it a part of the Kingdom of God?

[Bootstrap]

Politics has always been an outrage machine and always will be. I remember as a youngster noting the bashing of the other side that took place in every election. That's the nature of politics.

I have a simple question for you. Is your well documented dislike of Trump and MAGA Republicans part of the political outrage machine or is it a part of the Kingdom of God?

I think, Gary, that outrage and fighting is who Donald Trump and MAGA are, primary aspects of their identity. I think that they are telling us "I am the only one who can save you", that we need to be scared out of our wits and put our trust in them. And when you sprinkle holy water on it, it does seem to become a false religion that is quite widespread. That combination scares me. I've read a lot of history. I'm old enough that I've seen a fair amount of history.

I'm not looking for outrage, I am looking for insight. We should not be part of their outrage machine. Our identity has nothing to do with them. That's not where the Kingdom of God is to be found. Yet it is one of the main things so many people want to talk about and promote.

Do you criticize that as strongly as you criticize me when I point this out?

[Ken]

Like I said. Your example is from 2017. If Christian businesses were as commonly targeted as Jewish and Muslim businesses then you would surely have hundreds of examples to point to that are more recent than 7 years old.

Could you answer my question about who, exactly, is "targeting" all these Jewish or Muslim businesses? (And you haven't posted much evidence of Muslim businesses being targeted actually.)

Upstream I posted this link which shows nearly a 3-fold increase in incidences of hate against Muslim businesses since 10/7. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/asian-amer ... rcna122570

Have you not been paying attention to the news? Just last week there were three Muslim college students shot in Vermont. A couple of weeks earlier there was a 6 year old Muslim youth in Chicago stabbed to death and his mother wounded in a hate attack: https://apnews.com/article/muslim-boy-k ... 6564d9369e There are incidences of graffiti and broken windows of Muslim businesses (as well as Jewish)

As for who is doing it? Your guess is as good as mine. There are white supremacists and racists who are using the occasion to attack both Jews and Muslims. It seems to mostly be right-wingers attacking Muslims and left-wing Palestinian supporters attacking Jews. As in the video above. In many instances we probably don't know. Some could even be false flag attacks intended to stir up trouble or sympathy. You can read the news just as easily as I can.