“Five-fold ministry”?

[MaxPC]

Heard someone make a comment stating that a church in their town doesn’t teach five-fold ministry. Looked it up and it references the five ministries addressed in Ephesians.

Is this teaching associated with a particular denomination?

Is it found across denominations?

[Neto]

I have heard the term used in the past, perhaps in the distant, dusty past.... It was familiar to me, but I couldn't recall the origin, or application of the term. So probably in either the Evangelical Bible college where I attended, or in a church I attended while there, in that "Mennonite-less" "wasteland".

[Josh]

Heard someone make a comment stating that a church in their town doesn’t teach five-fold ministry. Looked it up and it references the five ministries addressed in Ephesians.

Is this teaching associated with a particular denomination?

Is it found across denominations?

I suppose the next time you see someone, you’ll have to ask him or what it means.

[ohio jones]

Is this teaching associated with a particular denomination?

Is it found across denominations?

In current usage, it's generally a charismatic/NAR concept.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostolic ... c_Movement

[Judas Maccabeus]

Is this teaching associated with a particular denomination?

Is it found across denominations?

In current usage, it's generally a charismatic/NAR concept.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostolic ... c_Movement

Yeah, that is where I heard it as well. Derick Prince, C. Peter Wagner, and the like. Charismatic circles, was in the late 70s. Only heard it rarely since, never in Mennonite circles.

[MaxPC]

Is this teaching associated with a particular denomination?

Is it found across denominations?

In current usage, it's generally a charismatic/NAR concept.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostolic ... c_Movement

Thank you, OJ. That article is helpful. I see in the article that this terminology is re-emerging in what appears to me to be a blending of the Early Church movement, Evangelical and Charismatic practices. It does not seem to be associated with particular denominations but is gaining ground in independent fellowships.

I have heard the term used in the past, perhaps in the distant, dusty past.... It was familiar to me, but I couldn't recall the origin, or application of the term. So probably in either the Evangelical Bible college where I attended, or in a church I attended while there, in that "Mennonite-less" "wasteland".

The five-fold ministry term seems to be in revival again. The person who used it was recommending a church to another who is leaving his United Methodist church.

[barnhart]

It feels to me like this movement has taken a biblical role or gifting (prophecy) and created a church structure to meet the needs of that role. I see it similar to the authority structure created for bishops by the high church model or the little fiefdoms of low church with a single prominent leader. Another analogy might be a hypothetical church that springs up in a heavily animistic culture where the gift of healing is expanded in importance until pastor and witch doctor become the same role.

[Valerie]

I've heard the term for decades and Ephesians 4:11 as a reference. Also "Full Gospel" ministry teaching. Where we come from, if Ephesians 4:11 is seen as only during Apostolic times, then our churches would see those as missing the full Gospel. I remember an acquaintance I had for awhile, who grew up Amish, family then became. Mennonite then her & her husband left Mennonite and said they were "Full Gospel" now. Five-Fold Ministry.

Where we currently attend, would be considered an Evangelical church, occasionally senior pastor does a Q & A. He read one of the submitted questions asking if he believed in Five-Fold Fold Ministry. Pastor answered he didn't even know what that was. I was kind of surprised fe didn't since I heard it for decades

Seems kind of like a litmus test to see if churches/pastors are enlightened and believe the Full Gospel, if not, avoid those churches-

[Neto]

Is this teaching associated with a particular denomination?

Is it found across denominations?

In current usage, it's generally a charismatic/NAR concept.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostolic ... c_Movement

Thank you, OJ. That article is helpful. I see in the article that this terminology is re-emerging in what appears to me to be a blending of the Early Church movement, Evangelical and Charismatic practices. It does not seem to be associated with particular denominations but is gaining ground in independent fellowships.

Max, this raises a question in my mind, as to something touching on your personal experience as a Catholic. What was your experience in relating to the charismatic practices adopted by some within the Catholic Church during the 60's and 70's? How open were you and are you to these "manifestations of the Spirit"? (Obviously, you are not required in any way to answer. I do not want to pry into personal matters.)

In my own involvement in the larger 'Charismatic Movement', I sometimes met Catholic Charismatics, and even my paternal grandparents, who were very traditionalist Mennonite Brethren (uncut hair, long sleeve shirts for men, and color restrictions as well, for example) were in some ways influenced by some of this. (Of course we as MBs also have a sort of 'charismatic' history - not 'speaking in tongues', but in a much more 'joyous' expression in worship. Unfortunately it became rather extreme, beating on pots and such like, then came into direct conflict with an opposite strain of thought within MB circles, also rather extreme, that eventually "won out". I wish there would have been a middle of the road path taken, one characterized by mutual acceptance on both sides. This was all in the first 10 to 15 years of MB history, starting in 1860.)

[MaxPC]

In current usage, it's generally a charismatic/NAR concept.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostolic ... c_Movement

Thank you, OJ. That article is helpful. I see in the article that this terminology is re-emerging in what appears to me to be a blending of the Early Church movement, Evangelical and Charismatic practices. It does not seem to be associated with particular denominations but is gaining ground in independent fellowships.

Max, this raises a question in my mind, as to something touching on your personal experience as a Catholic. What was your experience in relating to the charismatic practices adopted by some within the Catholic Church during the 60's and 70's? How open were you and are you to these "manifestations of the Spirit"? (Obviously, you are not required in any way to answer. I do not want to pry into personal matters.)

In my own involvement in the larger 'Charismatic Movement', I sometimes met Catholic Charismatics, and even my paternal grandparents, who were very traditionalist Mennonite Brethren (uncut hair, long sleeve shirts for men, and color restrictions as well, for example) were in some ways influenced by some of this. (Of course we as MBs also have a sort of 'charismatic' history - not 'speaking in tongues', but in a much more 'joyous' expression in worship. Unfortunately it became rather extreme, beating on pots and such like, then came into direct conflict with an opposite strain of thought within MB circles, also rather extreme, that eventually "won out". I wish there would have been a middle of the road path taken, one characterized by mutual acceptance on both sides. This was all in the first 10 to 15 years of MB history, starting in 1860.)

Great question, Neto. I cannot recall the exact year when I first encountered the Catholic Charismatic Movement (their official name). I believe it was either the late 60s or may have been early 70s: my ancient brain is showing it’s age. My impression was that this was a group of Catholics who were seeking an emotional expression of their worship experience.

I am of the “faith and reason” flavor of Catholicism so it was not my cuppa. There are almost as many expressions within Catholicism as there are ethnicities. The Church has 7 different rites with their own liturgies for example so I mentally filed it as another expression of Catholicism.

The CCM still exists today but it is quieter, less emotional. They have weekly prayer groups to intercede for various situations and people. “Spiritual Warfare” is one their favorite themes to fight demons/evil/temptations. The Vatican has a CCM priest among several priests who occasionally give homilies and day retreats to the Pope and Vatican staff. The CCM priest has been there since the 1990s.

All in all, I see the CCM as meeting a need of a subsection of members within the vast diversity that is the Church.