I Timothy wrote:
There is a difference between lone wolf (ie JM) and management allowing a lone wolf run lose. Management knowing about JM and HH is a game changer.
I really have not seen CAM or its supporting churches do a lot to work within the Christian community at large. In fact sermons I listen to blast all other forms of Christianity for being "worldly". The CA movement wants to be the third way, it is not trying to build ties with other church groups. Again, what disqualified GRACE from being called? They aren't Mennonite/Amish.
Do you know this for a fact, or is it just an assumption?
I suspect the latter, unless you are actually sitting in their board meetings.
J.M.
J.M., I'm not sure what part of that statement you're questioning but if it's the part about GRACE not being invited to investigate then here's the quote from RZher after he talked to David Troyer.
RZehr wrote:My understanding from DT is that some of them had a bit of hesitation over GRACE because it is not an Anabaptist based organization.
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No half-heartedness and no worldly fear must turn us aside from following the light unflinchingly. --J.R.R. Tolkien
When you can't run, you crawl, and when you can't crawl - when you can't do that...you find someone to carry you. --Firefly
I Timothy wrote:
There is a difference between lone wolf (ie JM) and management allowing a lone wolf run lose. Management knowing about JM and HH is a game changer.
I really have not seen CAM or its supporting churches do a lot to work within the Christian community at large. In fact sermons I listen to blast all other forms of Christianity for being "worldly". The CA movement wants to be the third way, it is not trying to build ties with other church groups. Again, what disqualified GRACE from being called? They aren't Mennonite/Amish.
Do you know this for a fact, or is it just an assumption?
I suspect the latter, unless you are actually sitting in their board meetings.
J.M.
J.M., I'm not sure what part of that statement you're questioning but if it's the part about GRACE not being invited to investigate then here's the quote from RZher after he talked to David Troyer.
RZehr wrote:My understanding from DT is that some of them had a bit of hesitation over GRACE because it is not an Anabaptist based organization.
Meaning that he does not have first hand knowledge of this. It appears to be little more than a widely held assumption at this point. A bit of hesitation is not “this is why.” One factor that people may not be considering is cost. GRACE is run by a bunch of lawyers. Oh, by the way, you do know that Boz has left GRACE and is headed into private law practice. My guess is he has many possible contacts from the SBC to keep him busy.
Judas Maccabeus wrote:
Do you know this for a fact, or is it just an assumption?
I suspect the latter, unless you are actually sitting in their board meetings.
J.M.
J.M., I'm not sure what part of that statement you're questioning but if it's the part about GRACE not being invited to investigate then here's the quote from RZher after he talked to David Troyer.
RZehr wrote:My understanding from DT is that some of them had a bit of hesitation over GRACE because it is not an Anabaptist based organization.
Meaning that he does not have first hand knowledge of this. It appears to be little more than a widely held assumption at this point. A bit of hesitation is not “this is why.” One factor that people may not be considering is cost. GRACE is run by a bunch of lawyers. Oh, by the way, you do know that Boz has left GRACE and is headed into private law practice. My guess is he has many possible contacts from the SBC to keep him busy.
J.M.
I'm sure CAM could find the money somewhere to pay for an impartial 3rd party investigation.
Yes I know Boz has left GRACE. What does that have to do with GRACE and CAM?
Do you have firsthand knowledge that Boz has many possible contacts from the SBC to keep him busy or is that little more than an assumption on your part?
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No half-heartedness and no worldly fear must turn us aside from following the light unflinchingly. --J.R.R. Tolkien
When you can't run, you crawl, and when you can't crawl - when you can't do that...you find someone to carry you. --Firefly
Aurien wrote:
J.M., I'm not sure what part of that statement you're questioning but if it's the part about GRACE not being invited to investigate then here's the quote from RZher after he talked to David Troyer.
Meaning that he does not have first hand knowledge of this. It appears to be little more than a widely held assumption at this point. A bit of hesitation is not “this is why.” One factor that people may not be considering is cost. GRACE is run by a bunch of lawyers. Oh, by the way, you do know that Boz has left GRACE and is headed into private law practice. My guess is he has many possible contacts from the SBC to keep him busy.
J.M.
I'm sure CAM could find the money somewhere to pay for an impartial 3rd party investigation.
Yes I know Boz has left GRACE. What does that have to do with GRACE and CAM?
Do you have firsthand knowledge that Boz has many possible contacts from the SBC to keep him busy or is that little more than an assumption on your part?
Actually I do. If you listen carefully to his speech to ERLC, he says that he has knowledge of issues in the SBC.
A few of my friends are now in leadership in SBC churches.
steve-in-kville wrote:I just googled SBC and came up with Southern Baptist Church. Are we discussing the same thing?
We are. When my former church closed , most of its members were divided between IFB and SBC churches. For the record ERLC is their ethics and religious liberty commission.
ABC 123 wrote:
CA are almost proud of eschewing proper education and training. Our ways are better, and who needs a degree for that??
I don't know where you are from but the area I live in (Lancaster, PA.) That statement is NOT true. When you make blanket statements about conservative Anabaptist's, you are speaking about ALL of them.
This thread is turning into distortions and gross exaggerations.
I’m also from Lancaster and I would agree with ABC123. This kind of thinking exists in Lancaster too, and it’s not just a small group of people, it’s throughout the entire CA communities. Oh it’s probably better than it was, but it’s still there.
ABC 123 wrote:
CA are almost proud of eschewing proper education and training. Our ways are better, and who needs a degree for that??
I don't know where you are from but the area I live in (Lancaster, PA.) That statement is NOT true. When you make blanket statements about conservative Anabaptist's, you are speaking about ALL of them.
This thread is turning into distortions and gross exaggerations.
I’m also from Lancaster and I would agree with ABC123. This kind of thinking exists in Lancaster too, and it’s not just a small group of people, it’s throughout the entire CA communities. Oh it’s probably better than it was, but it’s still there.
I've started a separate thread to discuss this. This is an issue that is not specific to CAM.
ABC 123 wrote:
CA are almost proud of eschewing proper education and training. Our ways are better, and who needs a degree for that??
I don't know where you are from but the area I live in (Lancaster, PA.) That statement is NOT true. When you make blanket statements about conservative Anabaptist's, you are speaking about ALL of them.
This thread is turning into distortions and gross exaggerations.
I’m also from Lancaster and I would agree with ABC123. This kind of thinking exists in Lancaster too, and it’s not just a small group of people, it’s throughout the entire CA communities. Oh it’s probably better than it was, but it’s still there.
So are you saying anyone CA who doesn't use secular schooling is automatically proud? Because that is exactly what it sounds like.
And this is the same attitude I have heard from Protestants toward Christians that footwash, headcover, practice non-resistance, and the such...
And so as you continue to accuse peoples motives I can completely understand and even side with CAM NOT using an organization like GRACE because with these continued accusations it is easy to believe any third party may automatically have these biases too and never be able to help in a God honouring way.
And with that I don't believe it is CA's placing others outside, it is rather you calling people proud that YOU put CA's outside.
