Gender confusion

[temporal1]

Humans have great capacity for deep+abidng love, that doesn’t manifest in physical or carnal acts.
Literature is filled with it. Between all combinations of sexes, and ages, too.

Presently, “the dominant narrative” doesn’t allow for this at all. Everything possible is reduced to the carnal.
Another Big Lie.

Unfortunately, human reasoning dabbling in God’s design and creation is causing untold misery.
Including child mutilation.

[Ken]

If you drill down you will find that most of those 30% are women who consider themselves bi. In the past I think it was highly plausible that there were many women living normal heterosexual lives but who also found women attractive. Which is the definition of bi.

Objection, your honor: assumes facts not in evidence.

No, there are plenty of facts in evidence.

1. LGBT means Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Trans

2. Surveys that parse this topic find that the biggest category of people who identify as LGBT are bisexual women. Here is just one reputable survey on the topic:



3. Just because people identify as having one particular sexual inclination doesn't mean they act on it. I most certainly identified as straight when I was a teenager and paid much of my waking life thinking about girls. But I didn't act on it and wasn't sexually active. Nevertheless I was still most definitely straight. Likewise, there are many women who identify as bi because they find both men and women attractive. Or are simply curious about women, even though they live ordinary straight lives and don't necessarily ever act on their bi curiosities.

When you cite something like your 30% statistic, understand what you are actually citing. It isn't the number of women living gay or trans lives. It includes the total number of women who have ever had any same sex attraction or curiosity, even if they have never acted on it. Which is a lot. Both today and no doubt in the past.

The only difference is in the past we didn't have a name for it and didn't survey people about it either. And there is obviously less social stigma today than in the past which could make people more open to answering honestly. And frankly with today's GenZ it seems kind of trendy just to say you are bi, even if you never act on it. But just because we didn't measure something in the past doesn't mean it didn't exist. We didn't observe or name the planet Pluto until 1930. But I'm pretty sure it existed before then too.

[JohnH]

No, there are plenty of facts in evidence.

1. LGBT means Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Trans

2. Surveys that parse this topic find that the biggest category of people who identify as LGBT are bisexual women. Here is just one reputable survey on the topic:

I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that women are not "gay men".

[Ken]

I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that women are not "gay men".

None of the 30% of women you cited as identifying as "LGBT" are either. Which is what my comment was about. Here is a more recent Gallup study which found that Among women who identify as LGBTQ+, a large majority, 79%, identify as bisexual, while 19% identify as lesbian and only 2% as trans. In the LGBTQ+ population overall, bisexual individuals make up the largest group, with 57.3% identifying as bisexual. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/ne ... rcna143019

And from the article:

[R7ehr]

… The only difference is in the past we didn't have a name for it …

Sure they did. They used words such as sodomy, unnatural affections, unnatural lusts, sexual immorality, fornication, abomination, perverse, and deviant.

[JohnH]

No, there are plenty of facts in evidence.

1. LGBT means Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, and Trans

2. Surveys that parse this topic find that the biggest category of people who identify as LGBT are bisexual women. Here is just one reputable survey on the topic:

I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that women are not "gay men".

None of the 30% of women you cited as identifying as "LGBT" are either. Which is what my comment was about.

In your example, 19% are lesbian women, 29% are bisexual women. I'll be generous and throw the 5% transsexual in as women too.

That makes 35% lesbian, 9% transsexual, and 54% bisexual women.

Applied against the earlier 30% figure for Gen Z, that's 10% of the overall population being lesbian women. That's a lot higher than it was in recent history. Generally speaking, 10% of women haven't been lesbians, nor have 3% of them been transsexuals.

[Ken]

In your example, 19% are lesbian women, 29% are bisexual women. I'll be generous and throw the 5% transsexual in as women too.

That makes 35% lesbian, 9% transsexual, and 54% bisexual women.

Applied against the earlier 30% figure for Gen Z, that's 10% of the overall population being lesbian women. That's a lot higher than it was in recent history. Generally speaking, 10% of women haven't been lesbians, nor have 3% of them been transsexuals.

It turns out that graphic was from this 2013 Pew Survey: https://www.pewresearch.org/social-tren ... americans/

The more recent data from Gallup reflects the increase in women who identify as surveys as bi which I cited above.

Among women who identify as LGBTQ+, a large majority, 79%, identify as bisexual, while 19% identify as lesbian and only 2% as trans.

And from the article. The yellow bars for Gen Z and Millennial women are basically where most of the increase in the reported LGBT population is coming from:



So again, how much of this represents actual change in how people think and desire. And how much of it simply represents a change in how they describe themselves and the language they use. I think that is an open question.

[Szdfan]

Humans have great capacity for deep+abidng love, that doesn’t manifest in physical or carnal acts.
Literature is filled with it. Between all combinations of sexes, and ages, too.

Presently, “the dominant narrative” doesn’t allow for this at all. Everything possible is reduced to the carnal.
Another Big Lie.

Unfortunately, human reasoning dabbling in God’s design and creation is causing untold misery.
Including child mutilation.

It’s true that literature and history are filled with non-carnal forms of love — platonic love, familial love, mentoring love.

But they are also filled with carnal love — not just in Shakespeare, Lady Chatterley’s Lover or Greek mythology, but in the Bible itself. The Song of Solomon is a deeply sensual book about embodied love.

The deeper moral question isn’t whether the carnal exists, because it always has existed. The question is how we live with it -- how we honor the body without being ruled by it, and how we resist the temptation to simplify human nature into something it’s never been.

[JohnH]

Humans have great capacity for deep+abidng love, that doesn’t manifest in physical or carnal acts.
Literature is filled with it. Between all combinations of sexes, and ages, too.

Presently, “the dominant narrative” doesn’t allow for this at all. Everything possible is reduced to the carnal.
Another Big Lie.

Unfortunately, human reasoning dabbling in God’s design and creation is causing untold misery.
Including child mutilation.

It’s true that literature and history are filled with non-carnal forms of love — platonic love, familial love, mentoring love.

But they are also filled with carnal love — not just in Shakespeare, Lady Chatterley’s Lover or Greek mythology, but in the Bible itself. The Song of Solomon is a deeply sensual book about embodied love.

The deeper moral question isn’t whether the carnal exists, because it always has existed. The question is how we live with it -- how we honor the body without being ruled by it, and how we resist the temptation to simplify human nature into something it’s never been.

I've got an easy answer for you: confine sexual activity to marriage.

The end.

[temporal1]

Humans have great capacity for deep+abiding love, that doesn’t manifest in physical or carnal acts.
Literature is filled with it. Between all combinations of sexes, and ages, too.

Presently, “the dominant narrative” doesn’t allow for this at all. Everything possible is reduced to the carnal.
Another Big Lie.

Unfortunately, human reasoning dabbling in God’s design and creation is causing untold misery.
Including child mutilation.

It’s true that literature and history are filled with non-carnal forms of love — platonic love, familial love, mentoring love.

But they are also filled with carnal love — not just in Shakespeare, Lady Chatterley’s Lover or Greek mythology, but in the Bible itself. The Song of Solomon is a deeply sensual book about embodied love.

The deeper moral question isn’t whether the carnal exists, because it always has existed. The question is how we live with it -- how we honor the body without being ruled by it, and how we resist the temptation to simplify human nature into something it’s never been.

Professor Jeremy’s History of Love. 21st Century edition. Please, continue .. this could get interesting.