Calling people evil or demonic

[temporal1]

I think one of the problems of calling things “evil” and “demonic” is that it ends up taking away the potency of those words if we use them too much. I do believe that evil exists, but if everything I disagree with is “evil” or “demonic,” then nothing is.

When is the line crossed between potent enough and not potent enough? On the "potent level" Is the killing of unborn children and mutilating gender confused children, potent enough to be called "evil"? Just asking and curious to know.

The scale involved is horrifying. The efficiency. Has there been anything to compare?
If only more would take a step back to think about it. It’s chilling.

One day .. what defense is there? “We didn’t know better?”

[steve-in-kville]

I think one of the problems of calling things “evil” and “demonic” is that it ends up taking away the potency of those words if we use them too much. I do believe that evil exists, but if everything I disagree with is “evil” or “demonic,” then nothing is.

I agree with this. I almost never use the terms for that very reason. I've known people who were quick to through those words around and it is hard for me to take them seriously.

[barnhart]

A few years ago someone (who claimed to be a follower of Jesus) posted here, encouraging people to run over black lives matter protestors if they block the road. I asked him even if he doesn't agree with them, surely they are made in God's image and deserve not to be killed like that. He said they are not in God's image because they are not born again. I tried to encourage him to look into the doctrine of imago dei and reconsider this position. As I recall not one person on Mennonet responded to his claims except me.

I think dehumanizing thinking has entered the church through the wide open door of political commentary, the undocumented are "illegals", BLM are not made in God's image and politicians you don't agree with are demoniacs with Satan controlling them or "whispering in their ears".

Jesus acknowledged demons but never dehumanized the person. I'm not aware he called anyone demon possessed, rather he seemed drawn to them. He spoke kindly to them and treated them as people in need of the power of God. So should we.

[Josh]

Sin is sin- is one sin worse than another?

All sins are not equal, despite what Reformed doctrine or Luther may have taught. This is a key difference in Anabaptism.

It should be obvious that going on a preplanned killing spree is worse than thinking mean thought to someone for a few seconds. Or getting an abortion is a much worse sin than ignoring your children for a few minutes because you are preoccupied with some amusement.

The idea that “all sins are equal” was something the early church didn’t believe either; David Bercot discussed this at the recent AIC.

[Robert]

A few years ago someone (who claimed to be a follower of Jesus) posted here, encouraging people to run over black lives matter protestors if they block the road.

I never saw this. It should have been flagged and it would have been dealt with immediately.

WE have had some come in and call us demonic and evil. I do not use the terms loosely either, but at times they are fitting and should be used.

[Josh]

A few years ago someone (who claimed to be a follower of Jesus) posted here, encouraging people to run over black lives matter protestors if they block the road.

I never saw this. It should have been flagged and it would have been dealt with immediately.

WE have had some come in and call us demonic and evil. I do not use the terms loosely either, but at times they are fitting and should be used.

I vaguely recall this but my recollection of it is that Barnhart is not giving the full context. The context was they if protesters repeatedly try to block busy freeways and threaten violence to someone who tries to just pass by, it is eventually justified (from a legal perspective, not an Anabaptist one) to try to drive through a violent crowd to get to safety.

That is a rather different context than claiming “it’s good to drive over BLM protesters and I encourage others to do so”. Barnhart, is my memory correct?

[Szdfan]

I think one of the problems of calling things “evil” and “demonic” is that it ends up taking away the potency of those words if we use them too much. I do believe that evil exists, but if everything I disagree with is “evil” or “demonic,” then nothing is.

When is the line crossed between potent enough and not potent enough? On the "potent level" Is the killing of unborn children and mutilating gender confused children, potent enough to be called "evil"? Just asking and curious to know.

I appreciate the question. I'm prayerfully working on a response, because while I do want to challenge some of your language, I also want to do it in a way that creates more light than heat. I would hope that we might understand each other better than just cause more conflict.

[Bootstrap]

I think one of the problems of calling things “evil” and “demonic” is that it ends up taking away the potency of those words if we use them too much. I do believe that evil exists, but if everything I disagree with is “evil” or “demonic,” then nothing is.

Yes, that's one problem.

Another problem: it demonizes people, portrays them as less than human, and disposable. Jesus did say that the Pharisees were evil, I don't think he used that strong language with the woman caught in adultery, the woman at the well, the tax collector, or even with Roman authorities. In fact, he didn't use that strong language even with Satan in the desert.

Some of the things the Pharisees called out really were serious sin.

[Sudsy]

Sin is sin- is one sin worse than another?

All sins are not equal, despite what Reformed doctrine or Luther may have taught. This is a key difference in Anabaptism.

It should be obvious that going on a preplanned killing spree is worse than thinking mean thought to someone for a few seconds. Or getting an abortion is a much worse sin than ignoring your children for a few minutes because you are preoccupied with some amusement.

The idea that “all sins are equal” was something the early church didn’t believe either; David Bercot discussed this at the recent AIC.

I would point out what Jesus said about sinning here - Matthew 5:21-22

“You have heard that it was said to an older generation, ‘Do not murder,’ and ‘whoever murders will be subjected to judgment.’ But I say to you that anyone who is angry with a brother will be subjected to judgment. And whoever insults a brother will be brought before the council, and whoever says ‘Fool’ will be sent to fiery hell.

I take from this that how I may regard sinning as being greater or lesser sinning (i.e. due to the physical damage sin can cause) is one thing but Jesus points out the sinning that I could be doing in my heart and comes out in my talk. How close do I sometimes come to calling someone a 'fool' or implying that using other language ? Seems to me I need to be more careful with my words and according to Jesus those words are an issue of where my heart is, so I need to first focus on getting my heart right.

I believe all sins are equal in the sense that sin separates me from God when I ignore His guidance through the Holy Spirit to change my ways. But I believe I need to also regard in scripture how Jesus looks at sin. Sin is not equal in the obvious sense that speeding in my car is not anything close to me physically killing someone. However, Jesus says I can be guilty of murder in ways of not physically killing someone. I can point a finger at those who kill life in the womb but then go ahead and murder many people by my words. I know I don't give this serious consideration but I need to.

I think James Chapter 3 is a read worth re-reading often when it comes to what I say and also as Jesus points out that the words I use is exposing my heart condition. The words I chose to post here on this forum reveal what is in my heart. And how does that line up with the fruit of the Spirit ? Luke 6:45 -

A good person produces good things from the treasury of a good heart, and an evil person produces evil things from the treasury of an evil heart. What you say flows from what is in your heart.

Do others here see this differently ?

[JimFoxvog]

When is the line crossed between potent enough and not potent enough? On the "potent level" Is the killing of unborn children and mutilating gender confused children, potent enough to be called "evil"? Just asking and curious to know.

To me, motivation is important if we are attaching the word "evil" to a person. A long-respected Christian doctrine was that life (human life that should be protected) starts at the first breath. Those who speak of "gender-affirming" procedures believe they are helping. We may have come to different conclusions, but I don't think it fair to call the people with another opinion "evil". Misguided or deceived--maybe.

On the opening question, I think it takes the gift of discernment of spirits to know if something is demonic. If it is, casting out the evil spirit may be the solution.