Passive-Aggressive: How can you tell?

[Robert]

Online Passive-aggressive - Posting something on a forum to or about a person that you would never say to their face.

I think I just made that up but it sounds right.

[ken_sylvania]

Online Passive-aggressive - Posting something on a forum to or about a person that you would never say to their face.
I think I just made that up but it sounds right.

Isn't that just plain Online Aggressive? To me the passive part of passive-aggressive has to do with wording or actions being structured in such a way that taken strictly at face value is not aggressive, but carries an undertone intended to manipulate or hurt another.

[Josh]

Online Passive-aggressive - Posting something on a forum to or about a person that you would never say to their face.

I think I just made that up but it sounds right.

There was a rather amusing concept on some old artefact of Internet culture on the early 2000's that said that "Normal Person + Audience + Anonymity = Total Jerk".

It says that when a normal person is allowed anonymity and an audience, they lose social inhibitions and act inappropriately.

Here is my bit of passive-aggressive snark:

Some people choose to come to MennoNet and participate anonymously, but also post vociferously. They come here because they get an audience. And in turn they act in inappropriate ways I don't think they ever would in real life.

[Bootstrap]

Online Passive-aggressive - Posting something on a forum to or about a person that you would never say to their face.

I think I just made that up but it sounds right.

I think you're saying that if you have a gripe, you should bring it to that person, directly. I agree. I would add this: help them know exactly what you think would be better, tell them why, and let them decide if they agree. Telling people you find them annoying isn't terribly helpful.

[Bootstrap]

Some people choose to come to MennoNet and participate anonymously, but also post vociferously. They come here because they get an audience. And in turn they act in inappropriate ways I don't think they ever would in real life.

What kinds of posts do you find inappropriate? Any thoughts on how we can improve on this?

[Bootstrap]

Isn't that just plain Online Aggressive? To me the passive part of passive-aggressive has to do with wording or actions being structured in such a way that taken strictly at face value is not aggressive, but carries an undertone intended to manipulate or hurt another.

That definition is based on the other person's intent. I suspect we often cannot be sure of the other person's intent, and we are certainly not trained in psychological assessment. And while I agree that this is often a dynamic of passive aggression, it's probably not a conscious one. The person doing it is not aware of it. Another reason that using the term "passive aggressive" rarely helps anything. Even if we could diagnose people accurately, someone who is passive aggressive probably won't admit it.

So suppose we don't want to judge another person's heart or intent, can we make this more concrete? I think one think you are saying is that the undertone should not manipulate someone - "if you disagree with me, I will tell everyone you are a bad person" - or hurt someone - "let me tell everyone what a bad person I think you are".

[ken_sylvania]

Isn't that just plain Online Aggressive? To me the passive part of passive-aggressive has to do with wording or actions being structured in such a way that taken strictly at face value is not aggressive, but carries an undertone intended to manipulate or hurt another.

That definition is based on the other person's intent. I suspect we often cannot be sure of the other person's intent, and we are certainly not trained in psychological assessment.

Especially true with written communications. We don't have the facial expressions and verbal intonations to help us discern the intent of a person's statement.

And while I agree that this is often a dynamic of passive aggression, it's probably not a conscious one. The person doing it is not aware of it. Another reason that using the term "passive aggressive" rarely helps anything. Even if we could diagnose people accurately, someone who is passive aggressive probably won't admit it.

So suppose we don't want to judge another person's heart or intent, can we make this more concrete? I think one think you are saying is that the undertone should not manipulate someone - "if you disagree with me, I will tell everyone you are a bad person" - or hurt someone - "let me tell everyone what a bad person I think you are".

How to avoid being passive-aggressive - I know I need to learn to focus more on speaking graciously. I have a tendency toward humor at another person's expense, and toward speaking quite bluntly. Too often this has hurt others because puts them down - marginalizes them.

[Robert]

How to avoid being passive-aggressive - I know I need to learn to focus more on speaking graciously. I have a tendency toward humor at another person's expense, and toward speaking quite bluntly. Too often this has hurt others because puts them down - marginalizes them.

I fell _______________
when you ___________
because ____________.
I would like __________.

Filling in the blanks helps.

[Bootstrap]

How to avoid being passive-aggressive - I know I need to learn to focus more on speaking graciously. I have a tendency toward humor at another person's expense, and toward speaking quite bluntly. Too often this has hurt others because puts them down - marginalizes them.

I fell _______________
when you ___________
because ____________.
I would like __________.

Filling in the blanks helps.

Yes, that's one good formula. In general, I find it helpful when people say clearly what they think, feel, and believe. I also find it helpful when people do not try to tell you what someone else thinks, feels, and believes - especially when they do this to someone else in the conversation, pretending that they are the authority on what's going on in everyone else's heads without telling you clearly what is going on in their own.

Not quite the same formula, but here are a few, not aimed at any one person:

I feel welcomed
when you share your thoughts and feelings openly
because I can learn from you and be part of the same community.

I feel valued
when you respond to the things I said in a way that shows you took the time to read it - agreeing, disagreeing and giving your reasons, telling me how what I said makes you feel ...
because I know I am in conversation with you.

I feel angry
when you dump a bunch of political opinions into the forum and undermine anyone who disagrees
because that destroys any community we have in Christ by making political opinions an essential test of unity
and tells me that you are willing to attack my character for the sake of your political opinions

[Robert]

I feel angry
when you dump a bunch of political opinions into the forum and undermine anyone who disagrees
because that destroys any community we have in Christ by making political opinions an essential test of unity
and tells me that you are willing to attack my character for the sake of your political opinions

The underlined part would be going past assertive communication. It starts to decide and define another's their actions instead of stay with your feelings and wants.

Staying with just stating what you are wanting is not deciding for someone else or demanding anything. It is just sharing your wants. It is up to the other to choose to meet you at your wants or not.