Farewell, MCUSA

[nett]

We have a guide that if we are born again lives within us and is ready to instruct us. Ask Him. I believe those who live intune with the Holy Spirit can and will know what is sin. I believe a major problem is a disregard for Holy Spirit guidance and not being attentive to that 'still small voice' . Psalm 25:8&9 -

Good and upright is the Lord;
    therefore he instructs sinners in his ways.
He guides the humble in what is right
    and teaches them his way.

You repeatedly post about how how people need to listen to the guidance of the Holy Spirit, which sounds nice, but what do you when you have 2 (or more) people who believe they are hearing from the Holy Spirit, but disagree fundamentally?

[Sudsy]

We have a guide that if we are born again lives within us and is ready to instruct us. Ask Him. I believe those who live intune with the Holy Spirit can and will know what is sin. I believe a major problem is a disregard for Holy Spirit guidance and not being attentive to that 'still small voice' . Psalm 25:8&9 -

Good and upright is the Lord;
    therefore he instructs sinners in his ways.
He guides the humble in what is right
    and teaches them his way.

You repeatedly post about how how people need to listen to the guidance of the Holy Spirit, which sounds nice, but what do you when you have 2 (or more) people who believe they are hearing from the Holy Spirit, but disagree fundamentally?

Still ask the Holy Spirit directly. He may be speaking through one of them or neither. We also can ask for the spiritual gift of discernment to be able to make judgments. We are to 'test the spirit's to see if they are of God'. A well meaning brother or sister in the Lord may stray from being Spirit led and may give guidance from their own thinking. Like this post, am I giving my thoughts on this or is this guided by the Spirit ?

I believe as we grow in our relationship with God through the Holy Spirit we become more in tune with the Spirit and become more and more sensitive to His guidance. But if we don't regard the need for His guidance up front, then I doubt we will know His voice from that of others. We need to respect this wonderful guide that Jesus sent us.

[nett]

Still ask the Holy Spirit directly. He may be speaking through one of them or neither. We also can ask for the spiritual gift of discernment to be able to make judgments. We are to 'test the spirit's to see if they are of God'. A well meaning brother or sister in the Lord may stray from being Spirit led and may give guidance from their own thinking. Like this post, am I giving my thoughts on this or is this guided by the Spirit ?

I believe as we grow in our relationship with God through the Holy Spirit we become more in tune with the Spirit and become more and more sensitive to His guidance. But if we don't regard the need for His guidance up front, then I doubt we will know His voice from that of others. We need to respect this wonderful guide that Jesus sent us.

WHO decides who is correct? I've been involved in a lot of charismatic groups that try to do what you describe.

It doesn't work. It's a nightmare of perpetually splitting over hairs.

[temporal1]

i believe this speaks a lot to how we earthly ones are guided by the Holy Spirit.
it’s a mystery. yet, undeniable.

Proverbs 16:9
https://biblehub.com/proverbs/16-9.htm

Holman Christian Standard Bible
“A man’s heart plans his way, but the LORD determines his steps.”

I have that posted on my refrigerator.

Likewise. One of my all time favorites.

Wayne valued the idea of praying for the “discernment of the brotherhood.”
All things must be in God’s time and God’s will. Confusion is a tool of darkness. No shortage of it, either!

[Sudsy]

Still ask the Holy Spirit directly. He may be speaking through one of them or neither. We also can ask for the spiritual gift of discernment to be able to make judgments. We are to 'test the spirit's to see if they are of God'. A well meaning brother or sister in the Lord may stray from being Spirit led and may give guidance from their own thinking. Like this post, am I giving my thoughts on this or is this guided by the Spirit ?

I believe as we grow in our relationship with God through the Holy Spirit we become more in tune with the Spirit and become more and more sensitive to His guidance. But if we don't regard the need for His guidance up front, then I doubt we will know His voice from that of others. We need to respect this wonderful guide that Jesus sent us.

WHO decides who is correct? I've been involved in a lot of charismatic groups that try to do what you describe.

It doesn't work. It's a nightmare of perpetually splitting over hairs.

If what you mean by 'perpetually splitting over hairs' is church splits over issues not considered to be salvation and sin issues, then I think this could have been what was going on in the early Corinthian church. Paul called this behaviour 'worldly' and 'immature'. 1 Cor 1-3. One followed this teacher and another followed a different teacher. Paul said to work on agreeing with one another. I don't think Paul would have approved any church splits over issues that were not salvation issues or obvious sins stated as such in scripture that were being ignored.

In practise Paul corrected them in his book to the church in Rome, chapter 14, for their attitudes on being 'free' and criticizing those who lived differently, more restrictive, as unto the Lord. Paul's teachings allowed for variations in individual practise within a church that was done unto the Lord and were not sin. Unity in the local church is possible without uniformity if the focus is kept on serving the Lord.

Paul did point to sins that should result in disfellowship. I believe this is what MCUSA is now facing. Is 55% of those folks being led by the Holy Spirit or not ? 'WHO decides who is correct ?' The Holy Spirit. If one is in tune with the Spirit, I believe they will know what to do. The early church practise was to give much to prayer and fasting to hear from the Lord clearly. I wonder if those who made up the 55% followed that pattern or not or if human reasonings won out.

[temporal1]

WHO decides who is correct?
I've been involved in a lot of charismatic groups that try to do what you describe.

It doesn't work.
It's a nightmare of perpetually splitting over hairs.

Quite right.
There have been so many failures, some spectacular. It’s hard to impossible to even articulate anything about the Holy Spirit.
For many, a turn-off, a deal-breaker.

Our errors+failures, all of evil, cannot erase Jesus Christ.
Jesus knew we would need the HS, He promised we would have it.
i believe Him. i believe i’ve sensed it in myself, in tiny, private ways, and witnessed it working in others ..
but not by anyone’s command from a pulpit.

it’s Jesus’ promise, i sense it as a great mystery, i pray for its blessing+guidance. i pray not to be misled. i accept i might be.

i don’t recall Jesus saying the HS would be given to anyone who would then pass it along? i shy from such claims.
i haven’t been to a church as you describe. to repeat, in my experience, the HS is rarely mentioned.

because it’s of Jesus Christ, it’s important. no matter what failures/evils have wrongly unfolded in His name.
we must seek to rebound in authentic faith after failures.

.. .. that is, as i read and attempt to understand.

[Chris]

We have a guide that if we are born again lives within us and is ready to instruct us. Ask Him. I believe those who live intune with the Holy Spirit can and will know what is sin. I believe a major problem is a disregard for Holy Spirit guidance and not being attentive to that 'still small voice' . Psalm 25:8&9 -

Good and upright is the Lord;
    therefore he instructs sinners in his ways.
He guides the humble in what is right
    and teaches them his way.

You repeatedly post about how how people need to listen to the guidance of the Holy Spirit, which sounds nice, but what do you when you have 2 (or more) people who believe they are hearing from the Holy Spirit, but disagree fundamentally?

For me I would simply follow the Bible. What people sometimes think they are being guided by, test it to the scriptures. The Holy Spirit will NEVER guide us against breaking the scriptures.

[temporal1]

We have a guide that if we are born again lives within us and is ready to instruct us. Ask Him. I believe those who live intune with the Holy Spirit can and will know what is sin. I believe a major problem is a disregard for Holy Spirit guidance and not being attentive to that 'still small voice' . Psalm 25:8&9 -

Good and upright is the Lord;
    therefore he instructs sinners in his ways.
He guides the humble in what is right
    and teaches them his way.

You repeatedly post about how how people need to listen to the guidance of the Holy Spirit, which sounds nice, but what do you when you have 2 (or more) people who believe they are hearing from the Holy Spirit, but disagree fundamentally?

For me I would simply follow the Bible. What people sometimes think they are being guided by, test it to the scriptures.

The Holy Spirit will NEVER guide us against breaking the scriptures.

yes. and more.
scriptures tell us our understanding of scriptures is a blessing of the HS. i don’t have the passage(s) at hand. maybe you know it?

[Sudsy]

We have a guide that if we are born again lives within us and is ready to instruct us. Ask Him. I believe those who live intune with the Holy Spirit can and will know what is sin. I believe a major problem is a disregard for Holy Spirit guidance and not being attentive to that 'still small voice' . Psalm 25:8&9 -

Good and upright is the Lord;
    therefore he instructs sinners in his ways.
He guides the humble in what is right
    and teaches them his way.

You repeatedly post about how how people need to listen to the guidance of the Holy Spirit, which sounds nice, but what do you when you have 2 (or more) people who believe they are hearing from the Holy Spirit, but disagree fundamentally?

For me I would simply follow the Bible. What people sometimes think they are being guided by, test it to the scriptures. The Holy Spirit will NEVER guide us against breaking the scriptures.

Simply following the Bible has proven to be just as problematic as simply being guided by the Spirit. If you are saying that the Holy Spirit will not guide us today against a literal reading of scriptures I would disagree. I believe there are more to understand now about how to apply what scriptures say and this is not always a literal instruction. For instance, there is no need today to wash each other's feet but there are ways in our modern world to obey the principle involved. The Holy Spirit will guide us in how we can operate in our world and obey what God is desiring.

[nett]

Simply following the Bible has proven to be just as problematic as simply being guided by the Spirit. If you are saying that the Holy Spirit will not guide us today against a literal reading of scriptures I would disagree. I believe there are more to understand now about how to apply what scriptures say and this is not always a literal instruction. For instance, there is no need today to wash each other's feet but there are ways in our modern world to obey the principle involved. The Holy Spirit will guide us in how we can operate in our world and obey what God is desiring.

I'm sorry, but your contributions to this thread are entirely ambiguous and nebulous. how do you define what "listening to the Holy Spirit" is?

If I spend twice as much time fasting and praying than someone else, am I twice as likely to hear correctly from the Holy Spirit?

For a practical example, I completely disagree with you about foot-washing. I believe Christian should still adhere to the ordinance. I believe I'm hearing from the Holy Spirit, and you are not, in this area. Also, the scripture is firmly on my side. What are we to do about this?