Lisa Miller case

[Ken]

Sorry, I wasn’t clear enough when I wrote this. When a child is born during that marriage then the spouse has full parental rights. Obviously this doesn’t apply to children born before the marriage.

LM and JJ were never married.

Could you explain to us exactly why you feel JJ should have had "full parental rights"? Exactly how or in what way was she a parent?

Was she listed on the child’s birth certificate?

[Josh]

Sorry, I wasn’t clear enough when I wrote this. When a child is born during that marriage then the spouse has full parental rights. Obviously this doesn’t apply to children born before the marriage.

LM and JJ were never married.

Could you explain to us exactly why you feel JJ should have had "full parental rights"? Exactly how or in what way was she a parent?

Was she listed on the child’s birth certificate?

Let's rehash this. LM and JJ were never married. LM gave birth to Isabella. JM is not the father, obviously, and is not the mother either - the child has a mother, the one who gave birth to her. (And that was never in dispute.)

So, I'm interested in hearing what, exactly, kind of relationship you think JM had, other than "mommy's roommate". The child herself is an adult now and has made it clear she isn't interested in JM's continuing lawsuits on her "behalf".

[temporal1]

2014 / JJ named herself “NEXT FRIEND”

Case 2:12-cv-00184-wks Document 161 Filed 07/15/14 Page 1 of 12
JANET JENKINS, for herself and as :
next friend of ISABELLA MILLER- :
JENKINS, a/k/a ISABELLA MILLER, :
:
Plaintiffs, :

v.

https://files.eqcf.org/wp-content/uploa ... -Order.pdf

(Evidently, JJ+LM had a civil ceremony)


2021 / Now-adult in same-sex custody battle seeks removal from suit
https://apnews.com/article/vermont-civi ... 6c9365d010

- - - - - - -

Lisa is free as of this afternoon! Thank you Lord!

[Szdfan]

Miller and Jenkins were in a civil union, which is similar to a marriage and depending on the jurisdiction has the same rights and responsibilities as marriage. When the couple split up, their civil union was dissolved by a court similar to divorce.

It’s a complete mischaracterization to depict Jenkins as Miller’s “roommate.”

[Josh]

Miller and Jenkins were in a civil union, which is similar to a marriage and depending on the jurisdiction has the same rights and responsibilities as marriage. When the couple split up, their civil union was dissolved by a court similar to divorce.

It’s a complete mischaracterization to depict Jenkins as Miller’s “roommate.”

A "civil union" is not a "marriage", and the question at hand is whether or not JJ was the child's parent. (She wasn't by any reasonable definition of the word.)

JJ was Miller's roommate/girlfriend until they had a falling out and broke up. It was not a marriage and never was a marriage. There wasn't a divorce either. JJ's relationship with Miller had zero bearing on who the child's mother and father are.

[temporal1]

2014 / JJ named herself “NEXT FRIEND” (in the above lawsuit).

[Szdfan]

Miller and Jenkins were in a civil union, which is similar to a marriage and depending on the jurisdiction has the same rights and responsibilities as marriage. When the couple split up, their civil union was dissolved by a court similar to divorce.

It’s a complete mischaracterization to depict Jenkins as Miller’s “roommate.”

A "civil union" is not a "marriage", and the question at hand is whether or not JJ was the child's parent. (She wasn't by any reasonable definition of the word.)

This is completely not true. Stop lying Josh.

[temporal1]

None of us present is a lawyer.
The link below refers to the workplace.

U.S. law allows and protects religious beliefs. Example for workplace situations:

Religious Discrimination & Harassment
It is illegal to harass a person because of his or her religion.
Harassment can include, for example, offensive remarks about a person's religious beliefs or practices. Although the law doesn't prohibit simple teasing, offhand comments, or isolated incidents that aren't very serious, harassment is illegal when it is so frequent or severe that it creates a hostile or offensive work environment or when it results in an adverse employment decision (such as the victim being fired or demoted).
The harasser can be the victim's supervisor, a supervisor in another area, a co-worker, or someone who is not an employee of the employer, such as a client or customer.
https://www.eeoc.gov/religious-discrimination

(i presume) Josh has deeply held religious convictions. i may agree or disagree. he has a right to his beliefs, esp on an informal Christian opinion forum. right?

[Szdfan]

None of us present is a lawyer.
The link below refers to the workplace.

U.S. law allows and protects religious beliefs. Example for workplace situations:

Religious Discrimination & Harassment
It is illegal to harass a person because of his or her religion.
Harassment can include, for example, offensive remarks about a person's religious beliefs or practices. Although the law doesn't prohibit simple teasing, offhand comments, or isolated incidents that aren't very serious, harassment is illegal when it is so frequent or severe that it creates a hostile or offensive work environment or when it results in an adverse employment decision (such as the victim being fired or demoted).
The harasser can be the victim's supervisor, a supervisor in another area, a co-worker, or someone who is not an employee of the employer, such as a client or customer.
https://www.eeoc.gov/religious-discrimination

(i presume) Josh has deeply held religious convictions. i may agree or disagree. he has a right to his beliefs, esp on an informal Christian opinion forum. right?

Josh has every right to his religious beliefs. He doesn’t have a right to dictate the civil union laws of Vermont. Under Vermont law, Jenkins had legal rights regardless of whether you or Josh think she should have had them. You can try to dismiss these rights and pretend they didn’t exist, but that doesn’t change the facts of this case.

[Ken]

LM and JJ were never married.

Could you explain to us exactly why you feel JJ should have had "full parental rights"? Exactly how or in what way was she a parent?

Was she listed on the child’s birth certificate?

Let's rehash this. LM and JJ were never married. LM gave birth to Isabella. JM is not the father, obviously, and is not the mother either - the child has a mother, the one who gave birth to her. (And that was never in dispute.)

So, I'm interested in hearing what, exactly, kind of relationship you think JM had, other than "mommy's roommate". The child herself is an adult now and has made it clear she isn't interested in JM's continuing lawsuits on her "behalf".

It is a simple question. Was JJ listed on the child’s birth certificate?

The fact that you are equivocating suggests that you actually know the answer but would rather change the subject.